PDA

View Full Version : Floodwater diving Bull Shoals, Shadowrock Park



mm2002
05-29-2008, 19:56
We decided to do a "park" dive instead of going to TR today. One of the reporters who works for the Branson newspaper is a member of the local historical society, and really wanted us to dive Shadowrock Park to check the condition of an old homestead they moved to the area years ago. They are all concerned with the deterioration of this site due to the flooding, and the fact that we were willing to dive it interested them. The vis didn't look bad from the surface, so we decided to give it a shot.

Well, the maximum vis we found was MAYBE 2 feet. It sucked! There was lots of debris, silt, huge parts of trees and other crap floating around right beneath the surface, etc. The deepest we dove was about 16 feet, and even at that shallow of a depth, the water was ICE COLD compared to the 70F surface temp! There was also a lot of current, which surprised us. Over all, it was a nasty dive, one which I don't want to repeat. I'd rather do TR in Zero vis at 50 ft any day compared to this dive.

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic1.jpg

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic2.jpg

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic3.jpg

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic4.jpg

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic7.jpg

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic9.jpg

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic11.jpg

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic13.jpg

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic15.jpg



http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic21.jpg

cummings66
05-29-2008, 21:22
Cool dive, wish I was there.

texdiveguy
05-29-2008, 21:27
You are lucky you did not encounter water snakes...as those are prime conditions for them.

PepeDiver
05-29-2008, 21:32
the conditions may not have been great but to get to dive a location like that is pretty neat still.

skdvr
05-29-2008, 21:48
Damn man I think that is cool... I wish I was there with ya...

Phil

mm2002
05-30-2008, 08:40
You are lucky you did not encounter water snakes...as those are prime conditions for them.

We saw quite a few actually. They are everywhere around here. They won't bother you though.

PepeDiver
05-30-2008, 09:01
You are lucky you did not encounter water snakes...as those are prime conditions for them.

We saw quite a few actually. They are everywhere around here. They won't bother you though.

that would get me out of the water quick fast and in a hurry. If there is any one thing in this world that will cause me to turn tail and run is a snake. I've got a couple living in/around/under my yard. They're fortunate that I won't kill a creature unless I plan to eat it...otherwise they'd be long gone.

cummings66
05-30-2008, 10:56
We saw quite a few actually. They are everywhere around here. They won't bother you though.

I had a water snake chase me once, I don't know why but it did. They are much faster than you'd think when they want to be.

mm2002
05-30-2008, 19:06
We saw quite a few actually. They are everywhere around here. They won't bother you though.

I had a water snake chase me once, I don't know why but it did. They are much faster than you'd think when they want to be.

Well, if he was chasing you it was probably because he liked you. He probably just wanted to get a little closer and check you out better. He may have thought you were cute. You probably have a way with water snakes and just don't know it! :smiley36:

Seriously, water snakes are harmless. Even if one bit you, it's not going to do any damage. They have tiny tiny little teeth, and although it can bring the blood on bare skin, it sure isn't anything to get worked up over. Now, a 6 ft Cottonmouth, yeah, you'd better be getting out of the water ASAP! I just saw about a 5 footer a couple of weeks ago while camping by TR, and trust me, they aren't to be messed with. THOSE will chase you for sure! But a little 3 ft water snake? No biggie.

Here's the deal on aquatic snakes (and the wife and I both have a lot of experience, as we used to raise various species). A water snake swims with just its head out of the water, and you can see the wake of the body just under the surface (usually). They appear light to dark brown, with a bright pattern, and their head is oval shaped. Their body (like most non venomous snakes) is long and skinny. A copperhead looks very similar, but IS poisonous, and has a darker patterm, and a triangle shaped head. The body also gets very "fat" looking in the middle (like most venomous snakes) . Both of those snakes will (usually) do everything they can to stay out of your path, so I really don't see either as a threat. Now, a Cottonmouth (water moccasin) is very dark brown to black looking, and will swim almost completely on the surface of the water. It also has the triangular shaped head, and it is very poisonous, and it WILL come at you if you provoke it. They are not afraid of human beings! Most snakes have to be provoked for a human to get bit, but a Moc will come and get ya! :smiley36:

Notice the major differences in the three animals.

The common water snake. Oval shaped head, light colored patterns:

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/snakes/watersnake.jpg

The Copperhead. I couldn't find a pic of one swimming, but you get the jist. Trinagular shaped head, fat in the middle, darker pattern:

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/snakes/copperhead.jpg

Finally, the Cottonmouth, or Water Moccassin. Fat in the middle, triangular head, and very dark coloration. Their whole body is usually floating on the surface.

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/snakes/cottonmouth.jpg

Walt725
05-30-2008, 21:12
Gee thanks. Now I dont know if I'll ever get near the water again!
:)

navyhmc
05-30-2008, 21:21
mm2002, Great picts. You forgot one thing: common water snakes, copperheads and water mocassins all have one thing in common: a very bad disposition and all can get very agressive with minimal provoking-this includes being in the water with them 20 yds away. That and the water moc can bite underwater.

mm2002
05-31-2008, 06:55
mm2002, Great picts. You forgot one thing: common water snakes, copperheads and water mocassins all have one thing in common: a very bad disposition and all can get very agressive with minimal provoking-this includes being in the water with them 20 yds away. That and the water moc can bite underwater.


Yep, I've heard that too. My personal experience is that the Mocs have the worst tempers. I see water snakes and copperheads quite regularly, and neither have ever acted aggressive. That doesn't mean much though! Also, contrary to popular belief, ALL snakes can and will bite under water. If they couldn't, they wouldn't be very good fishermen!

navyhmc
05-31-2008, 07:30
Have to agree with you on the temperment of Mocs. Had more than one head for my canoe while on a paddle. But then again, they change their mind when you give the water a good whack in front of them. To date, I haven't heard any problems with attacks on divers so hoepfully they think we're something that will eat them while we're in the water so they take off.

skdvr
05-31-2008, 12:47
I had one pass me while descending on a dive once and it caught me off guard and scared me a little bit. I was descending to about 60ft down a tree and at about 15ft I saw something out of the corner of my eye and it was a snake going up. My buddy never saw it, by the time I got his attention it was already out of view. He thought I was nuts because he had no idea what I was trying to tell him until we got to the surface...

Phil

Rileybri
05-31-2008, 13:00
Copper head swimming (I found this image on Google it is not mine).
http://www.snakesandfrogs.com/scra/snakes/images/copperhead%20swimming%201r.jpg

mm2002
05-31-2008, 13:15
I had one pass me while descending on a dive once and it caught me off guard and scared me a little bit. I was descending to about 60ft down a tree and at about 15ft I saw something out of the corner of my eye and it was a snake going up. My buddy never saw it, by the time I got his attention it was already out of view. He thought I was nuts because he had no idea what I was trying to tell him until we got to the surface...

Phil

I don't know which would be the spookiest to me, descending down the tree, or seeing the snake!
That's one thing that kinda kept me on edge during the park dive. There are lots of trees out there, and because of the lack of vis you didn't know if you were diving under/into one until you were there. We surfaced one time, and were under an awning of one of the old buildings. It wasn't a huge overhang, probably 5 foot wide, but it was a strange feeling just getting to the surface, then your head bumps into something right before your mouth is out of the water. I snapped a pic of the wife when we surfaced. Just think of the snake possibilities under there! :smiley5:

http://www.mm-restoration.com/scuba/shadowrock/pic24.jpg

maverick
05-31-2008, 14:41
Only good snake is a dead one. I am in the country, and thanks 4 the pic. of the copperhead snake. My cat killed one last year by the house. I never got 2 C it but I know what 2 look 4 now.

mm2002
05-31-2008, 18:25
Only good snake is a dead one. I am in the country, and thanks 4 the pic. of the copperhead snake. My cat killed one last year by the house. I never got 2 C it but I know what 2 look 4 now.

You are evidentially young and misinformed, but that's OK because I was a dumb kid once. Please allow me to educate you to the best of my knowledge. First of all, Snakes are a very important part of our ecosystem. Without snakes, every part of the world would probably be over-run by rats and other vermin. Secondly, "4" is spelled "FOR" (in the context you were attempting to use it in). Thirdly, who cares what your Cat did, because....well...it's a Cat. Fourthly, "2" is spelled "TO" (again, in the context you were attempting to use it in). Lastly but not leastly, "C" is spelled "SEE". "4" is spelled FOUR.
Also, one term I used isn't actually a word either. LEASTLY......that isn't a word. But you probably wouldn't have known that anyway eh? :smiley36:

Am I just old?:smiley2:

snagel
06-02-2008, 17:08
Great information...I've had a Water Moccossins chase me in the water and try and get in the boat.

So resident snake expert - Is it true that snakes can't bite you underwater? I've heard this all my life and as much as I hate snakes I just try and stay away from them.

By the way, I vote that you are on patrol for snakes when we dive the Mystery Lake on the 15th.

S. Nagel

mm2002
06-02-2008, 17:14
Great information...I've had a Water Moccossins chase me in the water and try and get in the boat.

So resident snake expert - Is it true that snakes can't bite you underwater? I've heard this all my life and as much as I hate snakes I just try and stay away from them.

By the way, I vote that you are on patrol for snakes when we dive the Mystery Lake on the 15th.

S. Nagel

Well brother Nagel, yes, all snakes can bite under water. So don't hide there! :smiley36:
Sure I'll take snake patrol at silver creek! If you see me running, everybody run!!!!

snagel
06-02-2008, 18:08
Okay, I'll be watching you. If you start running I'm running, probably not sure why - sounds like a great setup here. Now, everybody is going to start running just to see if I'll run - I'm on to you.

I've never killed a snake because frankly I don't get that close to them. We have an understanding - they stay in their part of the world and I'll stay in mine. Oh wait, as a diver am I not in their part of the world? Might have to re-negotiate.

Cya in a couple weeks.

S. Nagel

mm2002
06-02-2008, 18:21
Okay, I'll be watching you. If you start running I'm running, probably not sure why - sounds like a great setup here. Now, everybody is going to start running just to see if I'll run - I'm on to you.

I've never killed a snake because frankly I don't get that close to them. We have an understanding - they stay in their part of the world and I'll stay in mine. Oh wait, as a diver am I not in their part of the world? Might have to re-negotiate.

Cya in a couple weeks.

S. Nagel

:smiley36:OK, sounds like a plan. But I promise if I take off running like a wild animal....there's a reason! I wouldn't screw with ya like that! :smiley36:

Splitlip
06-02-2008, 19:15
Thanks for the post Mark. Good stuff and very informative.

I was never one to swim in fresh water let alone dive. Did a quarry dive once (shudder). My hat's off to ya. Very surreal too.

As to your comment regarding snakes: Agreed. Just as sharks serve the open water eco system, snakes have their place. I live adjacent to a very large (by urban standards) preserve called the Juno Ridge natural area. I am constantly snatching snakes and tortoises up from neighbors yards and returning them to the preserve before the other "do gooders" come out with their shovels to do the critters in.
Sometimes I think I am in a space invader movie with these guys charging around with their shovels.
Or wait. Is that a monster movie? No I was right. Torches are for monsters and shovels are for aliens. Oh never mind. Digressing again.

mm2002
06-02-2008, 22:16
Thanks for the post Mark. Good stuff and very informative.

I was never one to swim in fresh water let alone dive. Did a quarry dive once (shudder). My hat's off to ya. Very surreal too.

As to your comment regarding snakes: Agreed. Just as sharks serve the open water eco system, snakes have their place. I live adjacent to a very large (by urban standards) preserve called the Juno Ridge natural area. I am constantly snatching snakes and tortoises up from neighbors yards and returning them to the preserve before the other "do gooders" come out with their shovels to do the critters in.
Sometimes I think I am in a space invader movie with these guys charging around with their shovels.
Or wait. Is that a monster movie? No I was right. Torches are for monsters and shovels are for aliens. Oh never mind. Digressing again.

Haha! I knew what you meant Tim, it's all good. I'm with ya bro. Some animals are purely mis-understood, but they do more good than bad in our eco system. I do not kill snakes, spiders, turtles, etc. (and the list goes on)

skdvr
06-03-2008, 05:47
Okay, I'll be watching you. If you start running I'm running, probably not sure why - sounds like a great setup here. Now, everybody is going to start running just to see if I'll run - I'm on to you.

I've never killed a snake because frankly I don't get that close to them. We have an understanding - they stay in their part of the world and I'll stay in mine. Oh wait, as a diver am I not in their part of the world? Might have to re-negotiate.

Cya in a couple weeks.

S. Nagel

:smiley36:OK, sounds like a plan. But I promise if I take off running like a wild animal....there's a reason! I wouldn't screw with ya like that! :smiley36:


This reminds me of a t-shirt when I was in the Marine Corps. I worked with bombs, and we had this shirt that said "If you see me running try to catch up!".

Phil

mm2002
06-03-2008, 06:31
This reminds me of a t-shirt when I was in the Marine Corps. I worked with bombs, and we had this shirt that said "If you see me running try to catch up!".

Phil

Yep, I've seen those! :smiley36:

cummings66
06-03-2008, 08:23
This weekend since it was my anniversary I didn't dive but did a day hike with the family. During the hike we saw a very large copperhead and a black snake so large it was almost unbelievable.

There are lots of snakes about right now, probably due to all the flooding. Ticks IMO are more of a problem.

skdvr
06-03-2008, 09:09
Ticks are CRAZY right now. If you are out and about in the more rustic areas I would bet you will pick a few up. Picked a couple off my dog a few weeks ago when I was at a quarry.

Phil

cummings66
06-03-2008, 13:56
My friend got a tick bite that the area swelled up about 1/4 inch off her back and was about 3 inches long, about like a rectangle. It looked like it hurt. I didn't get bit at all, but I'm normally pretty good about that. At any rate ticks are the worst I've ever seen in my life around here.

mm2002
06-03-2008, 18:07
I rarely get ticks either, but they are definitely bad this year. Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as my wife and kids, and I attribute that to the fact that I take vitamins. They say that the B vitamins along with vitamin C helps keep them off of you. Something to do with those vitamins making your skin less "palatable". Whatever, but I'm a believer.


edit: The statement "Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as my wife and kids" should have read "Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as THEY DO my wife and kids".
I probably just ruined a good joke for somebody...sorry.

Splitlip
06-03-2008, 18:37
You did. Thanks.

Along the same lines, I am seldom bothered by mosquitos. My mom tells me it is because of the garlic I eat. I never had any trouble with vampires either.

mm2002
06-03-2008, 18:57
Yep! I don't eat a lot of garlic, and vampires just bug the crap outa me. They won't leave me alone. I'm not really what you'd call "skeered" of vampires, but they do kinda creep me out. I'm going to add garlic to my vitamin regime.

coyote
06-03-2008, 19:14
I rarely get ticks either, but they are definitely bad this year. Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as my wife and kids, and I attribute that to the fact that I take vitamins. They say that the B vitamins along with vitamin C helps keep them off of you. Something to do with those vitamins making your skin less "palatable". Whatever, but I'm a believer.


edit: The statement "Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as my wife and kids" should have read "Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as THEY DO my wife and kids".
I probably just ruined a good joke for somebody...sorry.


LOL... Sigmund Freud would of had a field day with that...

mm2002
06-03-2008, 19:26
LOL... Sigmund Freud would of had a field day with that...


OK, this thread has went so far off track anyway, it just doesn't matter anymore, so I have to ask. Exactly what is a "field day". I've heard the term all my life, but I really want to know the truth.

coyote
06-03-2008, 19:43
LOL... Sigmund Freud would of had a field day with that...


OK, this thread has went so far off track anyway, it just doesn't matter anymore, so I have to ask. Exactly what is a "field day". I've heard the term all my life, but I really want to know the truth.

here we go... stolen from field day - Wiktionary (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/have_a_field_day)
Field Day: Noun

Singular
field (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/field) day (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/day)
Plural
field days (http://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=field_days&action=edit&redlink=1)


(military) A parade day. In the Navy and Marine Corps, "field day" refers to a thorough cleaning of the ship's spaces or on-shore living and work areas.
A school day for athletic (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/athletic) events; a sports day (http://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=sports_day&action=edit&redlink=1).
A day of class taken away from school for a field trip (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/field_trip).
(idiomatic (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Glossary#I)) A great (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/great) time (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/time) or a great deal to do. They went to the park and had a field day playing on the swings.
(idiomatic (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Glossary#I)) A great time or a great deal to do, at somebody else's expense (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/expense).The reporters will have a field day with a comment like that.
The scandal was a field day for the press.

Splitlip
06-03-2008, 19:53
I rarely get ticks either, but they are definitely bad this year. Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as my wife and kids, and I attribute that to the fact that I take vitamins. They say that the B vitamins along with vitamin C helps keep them off of you. Something to do with those vitamins making your skin less "palatable". Whatever, but I'm a believer.


edit: The statement "Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as my wife and kids" should have read "Ticks or mosquitoes don't bother me near as bad as THEY DO my wife and kids".
I probably just ruined a good joke for somebody...sorry.


LOL... Sigmund Freud would of had a field day with that...

His Freudien slip was showing n'est pas?