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View Full Version : Spare air, do you refill it for every dive?



junzhang
07-16-2008, 19:33
Just received the spare air from ST, the question comes up is that for the air is most likely untouched for the dive, would you keep it for next dive? or should I empty the tank and refill when I have the next dive?

frogman159
07-16-2008, 19:39
Just received the spare air from ST, the question comes up is that for the air is most likely untouched for the dive, would you keep it for next dive? or should I empty the tank and refill when I have the next dive?

:smilie40:

ReefHound
07-16-2008, 20:00
No need to refill it if it's not leaking. Maybe every couple months.

Please treat it as Spare Breath, not "spare air". First couple of dives practice breathing it down at various depths so you see how much (how little) air supply it actually provides. How long it lasts at the surface only matters if you happen to run out of air at the surface.

Most experienced divers conclude that it doesn't provide enough air to make a proper ascent with safety stop, and opt instead to use at least a 13cf pony. And usually bigger than that. But I guess a few spare breaths is better than nothing *as long as* having it doesn't tempt you to be less careful.

Crimediver
07-16-2008, 20:06
I rotate the air in my Spare Air so the shelf life is not exceeded. Any air left in the cylinder over that stands the chance of ther O2 turning into O1. I am pretty sure that could be bad.

ScubaToys Larry
07-16-2008, 20:13
I just leave it alone if it's full. I only empty mine for travel - and then when I get to where I'm going.. fill it up, and leave it full until it's time to come home.

ReefHound
07-16-2008, 20:37
I rotate the air in my Spare Air so the shelf life is not exceeded. Any air left in the cylinder over that stands the chance of ther O2 turning into O1. I am pretty sure that could be bad.

So what is the "shelf life"? And tell us more about how O2 turns into O1 (ozone)? In nature it takes an electrical charge to do that.

wsodonnell
07-16-2008, 21:38
yeah I'm curious about that too.

texdiveguy
07-16-2008, 22:05
I just leave it alone if it's full. I only empty mine for travel - and then when I get to where I'm going.. fill it up, and leave it full until it's time to come home.

YOUR carrying a Spare Air unit!????? :-0

Crimediver
07-17-2008, 04:18
I rotate the air in my Spare Air so the shelf life is not exceeded. Any air left in the cylinder over that stands the chance of ther O2 turning into O1. I am pretty sure that could be bad.

So what is the "shelf life"? And tell us more about how O2 turns into O1 (ozone)? In nature it takes an electrical charge to do that.

It gets the electrical charge from plugging it into the wall outlet. I turned my Spare Air into a lamp.

meesier42
07-17-2008, 06:30
I rotate the air in my Spare Air so the shelf life is not exceeded. Any air left in the cylinder over that stands the chance of ther O2 turning into O1. I am pretty sure that could be bad.

what exactly is O1 and what is the chemical process that is causing this?

air in a tank that was properly filled with high purity dry air will never "go bad" their is just nothing that can happen in there. Now, that doesn't mean that it is good store a tank full, but the problem has to do with metal fatigue not stale air.

Oh and Ozone is O3 not O1. O1 is so reactive that it simply can not exist in nature

Crimediver
07-17-2008, 11:31
Golly, you guys take things so seriously. The only air that really needs to be changed is the air in your car tires needs to be changed every 10,000 miles.

in_cavediver
07-17-2008, 11:49
Golly, you guys take things so seriously. The only air that really needs to be changed is the air in your car tires needs to be changed every 10,000 miles.

Who uses air, we use helium. It makes the car lighter saving on fuel......Isn't that the DIR answer? ;>

Swanny
07-17-2008, 12:19
Who uses air, we use helium. It makes the car lighter saving on fuel......Isn't that the DIR answer? ;>

Don't forget to put argon in your tires in the winter, as it helps keep your car warmer by providing better insulation.

frogman159
07-17-2008, 12:25
I rotate the air in my Spare Air so the shelf life is not exceeded. Any air left in the cylinder over that stands the chance of ther O2 turning into O1. I am pretty sure that could be bad.

Oh and Ozone is O3 not O1. O1 is so reactive that it simply can not exist in nature

Correct- Some molecules are known as diatomics- Meaning they only exist as 2 atoms stuck together- Oxygen, and Nitrogren among some other exist like this- I'm not sure its even possible to pull them apart in a lab let alone a Spare Air:smilie39:

OH-JJ
07-17-2008, 16:08
I rotate the air in my Spare Air so the shelf life is not exceeded. Any air left in the cylinder over that stands the chance of ther O2 turning into O1. I am pretty sure that could be bad.

Oh and Ozone is O3 not O1. O1 is so reactive that it simply can not exist in nature

Correct- Some molecules are known as diatomics- Meaning they only exist as 2 atoms stuck together- Oxygen, and Nitrogren among some other exist like this- I'm not sure its even possible to pull them apart in a lab let alone a Spare Air:smilie39:

Now come on, this is the magical Spare air we are talking about. where as with normal scuba tanks a panicked diver will have a SAC rate of 1.0 with the amazing Spare Air you get a SAC rate of 0.1
Since the laws of physics don't apply to it why should the laws of chemistry?

ReefHound
07-17-2008, 16:16
Don't be ridiculous. Spare Air cannot change your SAC rate. You are what you are. But the onboard transceiver allows it to receive air pockets via satellite which refills the little bottle nearly as fast as you can empty it.

dirtydon
07-17-2008, 16:23
summer air in the winter is bad for tires.stop in any tire store and ask them. they will be happy to change to the correct air ,for a small fee. i used to work in one and help peaple with this problem. nice guy that i am.hehehehe.

mike_s
07-17-2008, 16:33
I just leave it alone if it's full. I only empty mine for travel - and then when I get to where I'm going.. fill it up, and leave it full until it's time to come home.


Larry... why do you even sell these things?

ScubaToys Larry
07-17-2008, 16:53
I just leave it alone if it's full. I only empty mine for travel - and then when I get to where I'm going.. fill it up, and leave it full until it's time to come home.


Larry... why do you even sell these things?

I not only sell them... I use one. I have done a CESA from 100 feet... but it's not something I want to do routinely... And I did it by taking a full breath before going up.

I know a 19 cubic foot pony is more air... I know a 30 is more than that... I also know, I have a hard time keeping my weight in a dive bag below 45 lbs without an extra reg, gauge, tank, and brackets...

I know that for the diving I do, recreational diving mainly in the 60 - 80 foot range - now and then hit 100 or so, having 8 - 10 breaths will get me to the surface alive. Will my ascent be a bit too quick?? Maybe... Will I do a 3 minutes safety stop?? Probably not. But I will be alive to get to the chamber if necessary.

I've met a lot of guys on boats that laugh at my spare air - and that's fine. I ask them what they use - they tell me a 30, a 19, a this or that... "Where is it??" "Oh it's a pain to travel with - I just use it when diving the quarries in the states..."

So I would much rather have 35 surface breaths - which will translate to about 15 or so water breaths - than a 20 minute supply in my garage at home. I also have a kick using it as a snorkeling extender when I'm on vacation...

So I sell them because people want them, and depending on what your type of diving and travel is - they may be useful. As I say on the page - $200 bucks may seem like a lot for only 35 surface breaths - but if you are not carrying another air source, and you have some dramatic air emergency at 80 feet - I bet I could sell you one for 5 times that at that moment!

Crimediver
07-18-2008, 07:39
Larry makes a good point. A lot of my diving is in rivers where I am in less than 20 ft of water. A Spare Air would do the trick well there and I would hesitate to carry a larger pony bottle there as I feel I could do a CESA. I used to carry one but I had problems with my Spare Air check valve failing periodicaly so I quit carrying one and went with a small pony A little bit of air is better than no air.

As a cop I sometimes carry a very tiny small caliber pistol when I am in circumstances that preclude carrying a bigger gun with more stopping power. Even a tiny gun is better than a closed fist in a life and death situation.

pir8
07-18-2008, 08:13
Nothing wrong with a spare air for the Caribean. I'm not carrying a pony to there. Maybe I'll actually get one , one of these days.

digitalman
07-18-2008, 14:32
As a cop I sometimes carry a very tiny small caliber pistol when I am in circumstances that preclude carrying a bigger gun with more stopping power. Even a tiny gun is better than a closed fist in a life and death situation.

Well stated.

Scotttyd
07-28-2008, 16:32
Don't be ridiculous. Spare Air cannot change your SAC rate. You are what you are. But the onboard transceiver allows it to receive air pockets via satellite which refills the little bottle nearly as fast as you can empty it.
Wow, you just sold me on one, can I just use a spare air instead of my regular back gas, never again do you have to worry about air.:smilie39: