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SlvrDragon50
08-01-2008, 20:53
Can I buy something by paypal?

harb99
08-01-2008, 21:04
Can I buy something by paypal?

what are you trying or wanting to buy? something from ST's?

ScubaToys Larry
08-01-2008, 22:01
I thought paypal had a thing where you can transfer funds into a 1 time use credit card... Or just send us a check. The charges on Paypal to merchants are outrageous.

SlvrDragon50
08-01-2008, 22:27
Aghhh.. I wanna buy a Neosport 4/3 wetsuit..

Mtrewyn
08-01-2008, 23:16
I think there is a thing you can download from pay-pal to use it at any store

SlvrDragon50
08-02-2008, 09:46
:/ I cant find anything like a one time use card.

FishFood
08-02-2008, 09:49
Paypal doesn't have such a thing. And if they did you better believe youd pay out the nose and up your ### for it! :smilie39:


Anyway, the Visa prepaid cards are an option. Read:

Visa Gift Card | Personal | Visa USA (http://usa.visa.com/personal/cards/prepaid/reloadable_prepaid_card.html)


I know Walmart, and most drugstores have them.

scubasavvy
08-02-2008, 13:07
Apply for the Paypal Debit card...

SlvrDragon50
08-02-2008, 13:53
Cant, I'm only 15.

scubasavvy
08-02-2008, 21:42
Cant, I'm only 15.

Doesn't matter. You can apply for a Paypal Debit card as long as your name is on the account...

Vercingetorix
08-03-2008, 01:05
The charges on Paypal to merchants are outrageous.Is it more than the 2.9% with 30-cents transaction fee? Aren't standard VISA/MasterCard fees about 6%?

Brandon Belew
08-03-2008, 13:19
Use PayPal where PayPal is not accepted:
https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_vdc-plugin-intro

Enjoy

scottv
08-03-2008, 13:32
Is it more than the 2.9% with 30-cents transaction fee? Aren't standard VISA/MasterCard fees about 6%?


American Express is quite high, but Visa/MC are not near this. I own a small online bus and PayPal is the least profitable payment method. As an Etailer offering the best prices, this can make a decided difference. Add to this that the consumer loses many of their rights by using Paypal. I am personally not a fan.

Vercingetorix
08-03-2008, 13:36
American Express is quite high, but Visa/MC are not near this. I own a small online bus and PayPal is the least profitable payment method. As an Etailer offering the best prices, this can make a decided difference. Add to this that the consumer loses many of their rights by using Paypal. I am personally not a fan.Which on-line credit card processor do you use? Can I integrate transactions with applications that I develop?

ReefHound
08-03-2008, 13:54
Is it more than the 2.9% with 30-cents transaction fee? Aren't standard VISA/MasterCard fees about 6%?
American Express is quite high, but Visa/MC are not near this. I own a small online bus and PayPal is the least profitable payment method. As an Etailer offering the best prices, this can make a decided difference. Add to this that the consumer loses many of their rights by using Paypal. I am personally not a fan.

I fail to see how the fees are cost prohibitive to a site like Scubatoys. The PP fee is 2.9%, how much lower could VISA be? Even if it was 1% that's only a difference of 2%.

Remember you are talking about a vendor that routinely gives 10% off to various forum members or affiliates. I can usually twist Joe's arm and get him to cough up even more than that. They have a fair amount of margin to play with. To make a fuss over 1% or 2% just seems odd in context.

I'm not saying that PP is a preferred method for either buyer or seller but it would seem to be a viable option for those who do not have credit cards. I don't know how much extra business a PP payment option would attract but Leisure Pro seems to think it's worth it to accept Paypal.

scottv
08-03-2008, 13:56
I would rather not say which processor I use. I have many common customers with ScubaToys.com (I am in aquarium sales). Lets just say it is of the point and click type building. I do not know too much about the integration of it, but seeing that you are of the IT type, I'm sure you could. All I know (I have a partner that does the IT stuff, PM me if you would like more details), is that PayPal is the #1 most expensive method of payment for most vendors, followed by Amex, then Visa/Mc. PayPal does have its place. Those that do not have credit cards, websites not able or willing to invest in taking credit cards. You can add a PayPal buy it now button to a product for $0. I personally had an experience years ago with PayPal in which my product purchased was never shipped. PayPal will investigate, but for a fee. The result was found in my favor, great! But, the seller refused to pay up. I received my money from PayPal, less the fee. If the seller had payed, I would have received it all. To this day, when I make a transaction on this account, I have to call PayPal since I have an open claim. I will call them, they will say I am totally in the right, but still have to call them since it is unresolved. They tell me it is a matter of principle and the seller will not be able to transact until it is resolved. The reality is the seller can open up another account under a different business name and email and be back in business. I am only out twenty something bucks, but it is annoying. They just don't offer the same protection that a credit card affords to the buyer. Due to the cost and lack of buyer protection, I am not a fan. On the other hand, I do accept PayPal. It is comparatively expensive, but I do not screw over my customers, and I do want to provide the most flexible payment methods possible. Interestingly enough, once we started accepting PayPal, close to 50% of our sales came through PayPal.

scottv
08-03-2008, 14:02
I fail to see how the fees are cost prohibitive to a site like Scubatoys. The PP fee is 2.9%, how much lower could VISA be? Even if it was 1% that's only a difference of 2%.

Remember you are talking about a vendor that routinely gives 10% off to various forum members or affiliates. I can usually twist Joe's arm and get him to cough up even more than that. They have a fair amount of margin to play with. To make a fuss over 1% or 2% just seems odd in context.

I'm not saying that PP is a preferred method for either buyer or seller but it would seem to be a viable option for those who do not have credit cards. I don't know how much extra business a PP payment option would attract but Leisure Pro seems to think it's worth it to accept Paypal.

I have no idea what kind of margin ST runs on, but if a business runs on 1% margin, then this is a huge difference. Many online businesses do. Again, I cannot speak for Larry, but the net is about making $.10 off 1000 people, not $1 off 100. Also, the above and beyond service they provide does cost, it seems simple enough, but it does cost.

ReefHound
08-03-2008, 14:13
I have no idea what kind of margin ST runs on, but if a business runs on 1% margin, then this is a huge difference. Many online businesses do. Again, I cannot speak for Larry, but the net is about making $.10 off 1000 people, not $1 off 100. Also, the above and beyond service they provide does cost, it seems simple enough, but it does cost.

I don't know about your business but I don't think most online business are about 1% margins else you wouldn't see the plethora of "free shipping" options for $50 or over purchases. They are giving up as much as 20% on those deals.

I use PP to buy things all the time. As for buyer protection, you have a point (although you could open a new PP account as easily as that seller). But on the flip side, when I use PP I am not giving the seller my cc number and expiration date, which in some ways make it safer. When dealing with smaller sellers or remote sellers, I prefer this "push" method of sending them money rather than giving them the data to "pull" the money from my account. Although some cc issuers now offer the feature to generate one-time use numbers and defined amount transactions, it's such a hassle to use.

Brandon Belew
08-03-2008, 14:15
Back on topic -

Use PayPal where PayPal is not accepted:
https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/we...c-plugin-intro (https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_vdc-plugin-intro)
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_SC_28x28.jpgUse Secure Cards to shop anywhere online
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_Receipt_28x28.jpgSave and print your receipts
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_AutoFill_28x28.jpgEnter addresses with 1 click during checkout
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_FraudSite_28x28.jpgAvoid fraudulent websites
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_PP_28x28.jpgCheck your balance right from your browserProblem solved no?


OP can install the plugin, generate a one-use or multi-use card for Scuba Toys, funds are pulled from his PP account.

scottv
08-03-2008, 14:20
I don't know about your business but I don't think most online business are about 1% margins else you wouldn't see the plethora of "free shipping" options for $50 or over purchases. They are giving up as much as 20% on those deals.

I use PP to buy things all the time. As for buyer protection, you have a point (although you could open a new PP account as easily as that seller). But on the flip side, when I use PP I am not giving the seller my cc number and expiration date, which in some ways make it safer. When dealing with smaller sellers or remote sellers, I prefer this "push" method of sending them money rather than giving them the data to "pull" the money from my account. Although some cc issuers now offer the feature to generate one-time use numbers and defined amount transactions, it's such a hassle to use.


Many do run on such margins, why are the best deals online, even with shipping? Because on a global market there is always someone willing to sell cheaper. You could open an account as easy as the seller, but it is a lot of extra work to save a few dollars for someone that it doing things on the up and up. For a majority of the online retailers, they never see your Ccard info either. The shopping cart programs simply collect funds. Some will store your info, but the retailer, or no other human being, will ever actually have access to it. It is a "pull" scenario as you describe, not a "push".

scottv
08-03-2008, 14:22
Brandon, you do offer a great solution for those who do not accept PayPal.

FishFood
08-03-2008, 14:37
Back on topic -

Use PayPal where PayPal is not accepted:
https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/we...c-plugin-intro (https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_vdc-plugin-intro)
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_SC_28x28.jpgUse Secure Cards to shop anywhere online
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_Receipt_28x28.jpgSave and print your receipts
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_AutoFill_28x28.jpgEnter addresses with 1 click during checkout
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_FraudSite_28x28.jpgAvoid fraudulent websites
https://www.paypalobjects.com/WEBSCR-530-20080801-1/en_US/i/icon/icon_PP_28x28.jpgCheck your balance right from your browserProblem solved no?


OP can install the plugin, generate a one-use or multi-use card for Scuba Toys, funds are pulled from his PP account.

Interesting. Good find :smiley20:

However, knowing Ebay & Paypal, there IS a catch. There's no money to be made on the consumer end. So, I wonder what the business is charged to accept the "Paypal Plugin"?

scottv
08-03-2008, 14:40
For just a PayPal plugin with no associated listing/selling on your own site, zero money. This is one of the strengths of it. Although, if you do sell an item, it will cost.

scottv
08-03-2008, 14:42
There's no money to be made on the consumer end.

There is no money to be made on the consumer end. Just like there is no money to be made on that side with any other payment method. The consumer ends up paying all costs, otherwise why sell/finance?

ReefHound
08-03-2008, 14:54
For a majority of the online retailers, they never see your Ccard info either. The shopping cart programs simply collect funds. Some will store your info, but the retailer, or no other human being, will ever actually have access to it. It is a "pull" scenario as you describe, not a "push".

You miss my point. Whether the etailer chooses not to view or store the cc info, the point is they have access to it. I know for a fact that Amazon logs the transactions and if there is a processing glitch they have teams that pull up the logs and process it manually. I'm not worried about major etailers like Amazon abusing the info. But there are times when I may wish to purchase a widget from some small time seller who for all I know is working out of a flat in Singapore. I don't want to malign anyone but sites that sell infomercial crap, downloadable music, etc. where I do not fully trust the seller or the product but am willing to gamble with the purchase price. Let's say it's $20, I can use Paypal and send $20, if I get screwed I lose $20. Paypal isn't giving them a nickel more than I authorize to give them. On the other hand, I could give them my cc info then find out next week that not only am I not getting the widget but they charged thousands of dollars to my cc. Of course, by then the site has shut down and they have flown the coop. Sure I can dispute the charges but who needs that hassle?

scottv
08-03-2008, 15:06
For a majority of the online retailers, they never see your Ccard info either. The shopping cart programs simply collect funds. Some will store your info, but the retailer, or no other human being, will ever actually have access to it. It is a "pull" scenario as you describe, not a "push".

You miss my point. Whether the etailer chooses not to view or store the cc info, the point is they have access to it. I know for a fact that Amazon logs the transactions and if there is a processing glitch they have teams that pull up the logs and process it manually. I'm not worried about major etailers like Amazon abusing the info. But there are times when I may wish to purchase a widget from some small time seller who for all I know is working out of a flat in Singapore. I don't want to malign anyone but sites that sell infomercial crap, downloadable music, etc. where I do not fully trust the seller or the product but am willing to gamble with the purchase price. Let's say it's $20, I can use Paypal and send $20, if I get screwed I lose $20. Paypal isn't giving them a nickel more than I authorize to give them. On the other hand, I could give them my cc info then find out next week that not only am I not getting the widget but they charged thousands of dollars to my cc. Of course, by then the site has shut down and they have flown the coop. Sure I can dispute the charges but who needs that hassle?

Small time Etailers, unless they invest tens (if not hundreds) of thousands will NOT have access to your CC info. Hence they capture but never actually see your CC info. If a site is willing and able to write their own code, maybe. The point of this thread is ScubaToys.com, do they have that kind of reputation? The reason PayPal is not accepted (again I am not Larry) is because of an exorbitant cost and honestly the hassle (seems like little, but it is much in the big picture of things). It is just not worth it! This is why online is much safer than doing an order over the phone. With phones (land or cell) anyone can listen in and get your info. Look for the SSL cert, regardless of the website you order from. It speaks volumes! Disputing charges is a pain no matter what payment method. With PayPal it is more of a pain. From your post you would not buy more than $20 with PayPal? There in lies an inherent flaw. Authorize what you wish, but you still lost it.

FishFood
08-03-2008, 15:17
There's no money to be made on the consumer end.

There is no money to be made on the consumer end. Just like there is no money to be made on that side with any other payment method. The consumer ends up paying all costs, otherwise why sell/finance?

Of course the consumer "pays" the fees. That doesn't negate the fact that Paypal is a rip off, and some how some way this Paypal plugin is going to be as well. What does the business get charged for using this "plugin"? Is it any better than the regular Paypal fees themslelves?

scottv
08-03-2008, 15:21
There's no money to be made on the consumer end.

There is no money to be made on the consumer end. Just like there is no money to be made on that side with any other payment method. The consumer ends up paying all costs, otherwise why sell/finance?

Of course the consumer "pays" the fees. That doesn't negate the fact that Paypal is a rip off, and some how some way this Paypal plugin is going to be as well. What does the business get charged for using this "plugin"? Is it any better than the regular Paypal fees themslelves?


It is basically the same fees. It is a "ripoff" in my opinion. They basically charge a fairly high volume retailer the same as a one time seller on Ebay.

ReefHound
08-03-2008, 15:29
Small time Etailers, unless they invest tens (if not hundreds) of thousands will NOT have access to your CC info. Hence they capture but never actually see your CC info. If a site is willing and able to write their own code, maybe. The point of this thread is ScubaToys.com, do they have that kind of reputation? The reason PayPal is not accepted (again I am not Larry) is because of an exorbitant cost and honestly the hassle (seems like little, but it is much in the big picture of things). It is just not worth it! This is why online is much safer than doing an order over the phone. With phones (land or cell) anyone can listen in and get your info. Look for the SSL cert, regardless of the website you order from. It speaks volumes! Disputing charges is a pain no matter what payment method. With PayPal it is more of a pain. From your post you would not buy more than $20 with PayPal? There in lies an inherent flaw. Authorize what you wish, but you still lost it.

That's asinine. I could right now, at no cost but 30 minutes of my time, write a web form that you fill out your cc info and a PHP script that processes and logs it to a text file. If you transmit your cc info over the web, SSL or not, the host site has access to it.

Again, I fail to see where 1% can be considered an "exorbitant" cost at a place where 10% discounts are given out like candy.

No, I'm not saying I would only use PP on transactions of $20 but that I and I alone determine the amount I'm willing to risk, depending on situation. Giving your cc info and having the merchant "pull" it is like handing him a blank signed check and having him fill in the agreed amount. The actual financial transaction takes place between the merchant and the cc company. You cannot monitor or control this transaction, only accept or dispute it after the fact. VISA does not know what you agreed to pay and does not call you to ask (unless the activity is "suspicious").

scottv
08-03-2008, 15:43
That's asinine. I could right now, at no cost but 30 minutes of my time, write a web form that you fill out your cc info and a PHP script that processes and logs it to a text file. If you transmit your cc info over the web, SSL or not, the host site has access to it.

Again, I fail to see where 1% can be considered an "exorbitant" cost at a place where 10% discounts are given out like candy.

No, I'm not saying I would only use PP on transactions of $20 but that I and I alone determine the amount I'm willing to risk, depending on situation. Giving your cc info and having the merchant "pull" it is like handing him a blank signed check and having him fill in the agreed amount. The actual financial transaction takes place between the merchant and the cc company. You cannot monitor or control this transaction, only accept or dispute it after the fact. VISA does not know what you agreed to pay and does not call you to ask (unless the activity is "suspicious").

You could set up a site that will get the actual CC info, but how much would it cost you, assuming it "looks" secure to most? As for the 10% discount, how many people that order from ST do you think are actually that major part of the forum? They do not advertise the 10%, I only see it on the forum itself (if it is elsewhere, please provide a link, actual participation/discretion are used, I assure you). If you are not saying $20 is not not what you are willing to risk via PP, than why not list an example for $10000? The transaction does occur through the CC company, bank and merchant. This generally means the agreed amount. The "pulling" applies to that amount. If the activity is suspicious, or just claimed not authorized, PP or a CC will hold payment. The difference is that a CC will refund the whole amount.

ReefHound
08-03-2008, 17:23
It would cost me zip, nil, nada. You have absolutely no clue about website programming.

scottv
08-03-2008, 21:05
Hmmm, then please do, provide a link for all to see. It is just not that easy to get the CC info. It is quite obvious one of us has no idea...

ScubaToys Larry
08-03-2008, 22:01
Really, most every ecommerce package you can get just delivers the credit card info to whoever owns the web site... You just log in with your user name and password into the secure area and read, or print the credit cards. That is how it's done... then you can use whatever credit card processing company you use and punch in the numbers....

If you want them to auto process, then you sign up for another service - but none of this is at all difficult - nor does it really have anything to do with this thread...

If someone wants to use paypal - they can use that paypal plug in - then just run their order as a credit card.

As far as paypal itself - the charges they have are much more than what we get from our other credit card processing fees... so we decide not to do it. We do have a paypal account - and if that is the only way someone can pay - we can take it - but by the time we look at the extra steps involved in processing, getting payed, etc... we will basically have to skip the forum discount for you for us to have it equal using standard credit card payments.

So overall... just use a credit card... if you don't have a credit card - send us a check... but paypal at this point is not something we are going to spend a lot of time looking at. Maybe after we finish the changes on the new cart we can address it again - but not for the time being.