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larryjoe
08-29-2008, 18:15
"you need a spool and you need to know how to use it." I saw this quote on an older post about safety items to carry with you and I do not know about spools. I think they were also saying something about lift bags, I do not know what they are either. Yes I'm a green newbie. Any help would be appreciated.

"Thankyouverymuch"
lj

BouzoukiJoe A.K.A. wrecker130 AKA Chuck Norris AKA joeforbroke (banned)
08-29-2008, 18:20
Be careful. Bag shooting is an 'advanced' skill. Get some experience first. Don't mess with lines and lift bags for while. It's a great way to end up tangled and in an uncontrolled ascent. When you are ready- practice, practice, practice in a 'safe' environment before trying it when you really need to.

JahJahwarrior
08-29-2008, 19:12
A spool is the most simple way to carry line. Similar to a spool is a reel. Reels involve putting something like a spool (same kind of idea, but generally a smaller hole in the center, as it does not need to accomodate a finger, only an axle) on an axle, and adding a handle to it so you can reel in line. A spool is much more jam proof and cheaper.

http://tdl.divebiz.net/images/spool-spec.jpg

That is an example of a spool. The actual use of a spool is goal-specific and largely directed by personal preference.

My advice: buy a spool and then get someone to show you how to use it. But first, get comfortable in the water. Hard to focus on a spool if you aren't good at holding your spot in the water.


lift bags, submersible marker bouys (SMB's) and the like are important to have on ocean dives so you can be found if lost, or you surface far from the boat. I dive in freshwater caves and as such I have almost no need for an SMB, so I do not carry one. On the other hand, I carry three reels and two spools :D

Splitlip
08-29-2008, 19:24
What Jahjah and Joe said.

I do ocean drift diving.
One of my DSMB's (delayed surface marker buoy) pre-rigged with a spool.

stairman
08-29-2008, 20:44
You add a little air to the lift bag connected to a spool and you can shoot it to the surface.Open water tech divers sometimes use them for redundant lift in the event of a wing failure diving wet with double tanks.

WaScubaDude
08-29-2008, 21:10
Like to help with some distinctions if I can. There are four or five different catagories of inflatable thingies.

1) A safety sausage. SMB that is meant to be deployed only at the surface to signal a boat, a plane, or someone on shore that you are in trouble or just need to be picked up. Usually a thin long sausage or in some cases a small air mattress. These have no overpressure relief valve and would likely pop if deployed from depth. They also do not have strong enough connectors and webbing to act as real lift bags. The could help a diver as floatation at the surface though. Usually pretty small and easy to carry.

2) SMB or signal marker bouy that have an over pressure relief valve or open bottom to let expanding air out. Usually a thin long sausage. They can be deployed at depth or at the surface. If deployed at depth they are usually attatched to a spool of string or thin rope. Used to let a boat know where you are. Could be used to let someone topside know you are in trouble or need more air or to signal something specificaly agreed upon. ie; I FOUND THE WRECK! They can also be deployed to help divers maintain a given depth for a deco or safety stop. Some have strong enough webbing and attatchment points that they could be used as a lift bag as well.

3) Deco ball or balloon, small round (don't stick up too high out of the water when deployed. ) Usually very compact to carry and often will come with line and small weight attached, may have markings at 10, 15, 20 ft etc. for deco/safety stop purposes.

4) Lift bags: usually bell shaped and open bottom. Can be the size of your head to the size of a small car. Have heavy duty webbing and strong connecting points and are usually rated to lift a certain amount of pounds.

Choose wisely as each has its purpose. Also color standards/interpretations can be different in different countries or regions.

shovelhead91701
08-30-2008, 08:31
with deep deployment would it not be wise to tie off said bag or smb during inflation to avoid being dragged to surface while inflating, also a quick release tie off for yourself to deploy device with spool or reel to anchor oneself and avoid same problem when shooting line to surface?

dmainou
08-30-2008, 19:39
"you need a spool and you need to know how to use it." I saw this quote on an older post about safety items to carry with you and I do not know about spools. I think they were also saying something about lift bags, I do not know what they are either. Yes I'm a green newbie. Any help would be appreciated.

"Thankyouverymuch"
lj


Mate, google is your friend.

YouTube - SMB Deployment (dry run) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJlyH8Lgf4U&feature=related)

There are a couple of things I don't agree with that video (like the way the smb is folded) but for the most part its quite good.

Cheers

Diego.

dmainou
08-30-2008, 19:45
This is a video of how to properly do it underwater.

I think (due to the way its done) it is a DIR video but don't quote me on that.
YouTube - SMB deployment v2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfcEcCoIvKs&feature=related)

By the way when you actually buy your SMB, buy one with enough lift (to hold someone at the surface "rescue diver") and make sure that it is orally inflated as they are a lot easier and safe to deploy.

CompuDude
09-02-2008, 18:18
"you need a spool and you need to know how to use it." I saw this quote on an older post about safety items to carry with you and I do not know about spools. I think they were also saying something about lift bags, I do not know what they are either. Yes I'm a green newbie. Any help would be appreciated.

"Thankyouverymuch"
lj


Mate, google is your friend.

YouTube - SMB Deployment (dry run) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJlyH8Lgf4U&feature=related)

There are a couple of things I don't agree with that video (like the way the smb is folded) but for the most part its quite good.

Cheers

Diego.

The second linked video is the one I would have used, since that GUE instructor naturally did a perfect job of it (although it looked a lot more complicated since her SMB was not pre-rigged). That said, I don't see what that guy did that was so wrong. He was on land, so you miss a good bit of the demo... compare to the perfect buoyancy control demonstrated by the GUE instructor. (Disclaimer: I watched the video at work with the sound off, so I have no idea if he said something really stupid accompanying the video) But overall, the presentation seemed fairly accurate.

What didn't you like about the way the SMB was "folded"? That size SMB is designed to be rolled up in the exact manner he had it. You'll notice in the GUE video that the SMB is pretty identical.

dmainou
09-12-2008, 03:40
"you need a spool and you need to know how to use it." I saw this quote on an older post about safety items to carry with you and I do not know about spools. I think they were also saying something about lift bags, I do not know what they are either. Yes I'm a green newbie. Any help would be appreciated.

"Thankyouverymuch"
lj


Mate, google is your friend.

YouTube - SMB Deployment (dry run) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJlyH8Lgf4U&feature=related)

There are a couple of things I don't agree with that video (like the way the smb is folded) but for the most part its quite good.

Cheers

Diego.

The second linked video is the one I would have used, since that GUE instructor naturally did a perfect job of it (although it looked a lot more complicated since her SMB was not pre-rigged). That said, I don't see what that guy did that was so wrong. He was on land, so you miss a good bit of the demo... compare to the perfect buoyancy control demonstrated by the GUE instructor. (Disclaimer: I watched the video at work with the sound off, so I have no idea if he said something really stupid accompanying the video) But overall, the presentation seemed fairly accurate.

What didn't you like about the way the SMB was "folded"? That size SMB is designed to be rolled up in the exact manner he had it. You'll notice in the GUE video that the SMB is pretty identical.


It was rolled rather than say 'plied', zig zag, folded.

Its a stupid thing that may or may not be overtly relevant but may take a second on an emergency situation at the surface.

but you're right, the instructor did it flawless and it is a very small smb as opposed to the 55lb that I use.

Ta,

CompuDude
09-12-2008, 12:35
It was rolled rather than say 'plied', zig zag, folded.

Its a stupid thing that may or may not be overtly relevant but may take a second on an emergency situation at the surface.

but you're right, the instructor did it flawless and it is a very small smb as opposed to the 55lb that I use.

Ta,

55lb SMBs, depending on how they are stowed, are quite often folded, accordion-style, when stowed. But it's normal to roll up the small ones, at least, around here.

stairman
09-12-2008, 13:34
What amazed me is how the diver held position.When I breathe in I rise a few inches.When I exhale I sink.Its not a problem tying off reels but how did he stay steady while breathing?

Splitlip
09-12-2008, 20:07
What amazed me is how the diver held position.When I breathe in I rise a few inches.When I exhale I sink.Its not a problem tying off reels but how did he stay steady while breathing?

THAT is why I want to do Fundies.

All these years I have done pretty well dialing in my buoyancy, but I am not that good.

Splitlip
09-12-2008, 20:08
"you need a spool and you need to know how to use it." I saw this quote on an older post about safety items to carry with you and I do not know about spools. I think they were also saying something about lift bags, I do not know what they are either. Yes I'm a green newbie. Any help would be appreciated.

"Thankyouverymuch"
lj


Mate, google is your friend.

YouTube - SMB Deployment (dry run) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJlyH8Lgf4U&feature=related)

There are a couple of things I don't agree with that video (like the way the smb is folded) but for the most part its quite good.

Cheers

Diego.

The second linked video is the one I would have used, since that GUE instructor naturally did a perfect job of it (although it looked a lot more complicated since her SMB was not pre-rigged). That said, I don't see what that guy did that was so wrong. He was on land, so you miss a good bit of the demo... compare to the perfect buoyancy control demonstrated by the GUE instructor. (Disclaimer: I watched the video at work with the sound off, so I have no idea if he said something really stupid accompanying the video) But overall, the presentation seemed fairly accurate.

What didn't you like about the way the SMB was "folded"? That size SMB is designed to be rolled up in the exact manner he had it. You'll notice in the GUE video that the SMB is pretty identical.


It was rolled rather than say 'plied', zig zag, folded.

Its a stupid thing that may or may not be overtly relevant but may take a second on an emergency situation at the surface.

but you're right, the instructor did it flawless and it is a very small smb as opposed to the 55lb that I use.

Ta,

I ply (zig zag) my small one. Roll my large one. The small goes in a pocket. The large in bungie loops or a DR sleeve.

in_cavediver
09-12-2008, 21:14
Rolled - folded accordion style - to much effort. I stuff my lift back in a DR mask pouch. My sausage is rolled in its pouch. I have NEVER had an issue with my lift bag not coming clean out of the pouch when I wanted it to.

The point - don't overthink things.

in_cavediver
09-12-2008, 21:20
What amazed me is how the diver held position.When I breathe in I rise a few inches.When I exhale I sink.Its not a problem tying off reels but how did he stay steady while breathing?

Its breath control and residual lung volume. I can adjust my residual lung volume to account for the lift bag initially. (at least if I practice before doing it for the first time that year). Once I pass that point, I either will go slightly vertical to down scull while pushing in just a bit more air or if I am deep enough - just send the bag on its way.

I prefer reels over spools for this. Something about the potential for shooting a bag at 150'-180' and needing the scope. I usually carry a 400' reel for this in deep OW. For 60' or less, I'll carry a 140' jump reel.

The one place I like spools is for short gaps and when you want to carry a lot of reels. Our record is using 9 reels/spools between 2 divers on a single dive.

Splitlip
09-12-2008, 21:29
Rolled - folded accordion style - to much effort. I stuff my lift back in a DR mask pouch. My sausage is rolled in its pouch. I have NEVER had an issue with my lift bag not coming clean out of the pouch when I wanted it to.

The point - don't overthink things.

I find the "folded" one unfurls better than the rolled one. Not a real issue as I can shoot both. The folded one just let's me set up a little easier.
The rolled one retains the "memory" of being stowed.
The other reason I fold the one in my pocket, it is flatter.