PDA

View Full Version : Dive computer - AI or not AI



Suther2136
08-15-2007, 20:47
Hey all,

I'm looking for a dive computer and I'm torn between very expensive air integrated comp that does everything I could want, and a dive computer with an analog pressure gauge that's fairly affordable. Let me hear from both camps please, I hate being torn. I'm looking at say the Oceanic datamax or one of the watches with the tank mounted remote vs sat the aeros atmos 2.

Thanks for the help

NitroWill
08-15-2007, 21:33
I think the most reliable way is to go with a wristmount/clipped computer and then have a small spg/depth clipped off to the waist. The computer is right there when you need it --- and so will be the SPG if the computer fails..

3rdEye
08-15-2007, 22:52
I'll chime in here and say that I really like my Aeris Atmos ai

I clip it to my right chest D-ring, all i have to do is peek down and flip it up a bit and everything is there for me to see. It tells me my remaining dive time based on either NO2 exposure, air remaining or O2 exposure, and indicates which it is. It's small and streamlined, and nicely designed. Has the compass mounted right on top of it. like this:

http://i17.tinypic.com/4oudtle.jpg

Then when i download my dives, the pressure info at the beginning and end is recorded, pressure used is recorded, along with everything else.

Quick disconnect is a must, it just pops off and you can take it where ever.

a wrist ai computer would probably pretty sweet too, but I have no qualms with mine. I think the Atmos would be a little easier to read (larger) than a wrist if that's a concern.

MxDiver
08-15-2007, 23:30
check the following thread:
http://forum.scubatoys.com/showthread.php?t=902
it may help you decide.

cummings66
08-16-2007, 07:17
Can you afford the dive computer that you really want? If so, then buy it, no questions asked.

thor
08-16-2007, 08:42
I love having all of the important info on my wrist available at a moments glance. Never have to look for a hose and one less hose to worry about getting entagled.

Zenagirl
08-16-2007, 09:09
I dive with an AI computer and really like having all of my information in one place. Since it's a console, my compass is installed on it and I can even navigate AND see my computer screen at the same time. :D

When I need to replace my console AI, I'll go with a hoseless AI computer....I think it's worth the money to have AI.

thesmoothdome
08-16-2007, 09:15
I love my AI. It's chock full of fun information :). Mine's not hoseless though. For some reason, I'm one of a handful of people in the world who don't like wrist mounted gauges.

Like cumming66 said, if it's not a financial concern, then go for it.

fire diver
08-16-2007, 12:15
I personally don't like AI computers. If something goes wrong, or leaks, you loose everything, pressure, depth, time, everything. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I like seperate and redundant. I carry a brass and glass SPG, a computer, a watch for backup timer, and soon a backup bottom timer. All of that combined costs less than an AI computer.

But if you like the AI, then go with that. I'm a "Dive What You Like" diver.

FD

loudgonzo
08-16-2007, 12:18
I have a bad habit of always trying to get the best (read, more expensive), whether I need it or not. So I'm actually saving for a AI wrist mount, even though I know I really don't need it. I'm still married, I love my wife.

ertechsg
08-16-2007, 12:33
I love my pro vt but then again I also dive with an integrated octo and according to some I have a death wish

Suther2136
08-16-2007, 12:49
Thanks all that's a big help. So what you are realy saying is, not if but which expensive AI am I going to buy next. Time to go shopping...

CompuDude
08-16-2007, 13:31
AI is a nice luxury. If you can afford it, go for it. I vastly prefer having my gauges on my wrist.

That said, it's only a nice luxury. It's arguable that the money spent over non-AI would be better spent on dive trips or instruction. *shrug* Only you can make that determination.

Something to consider, however: If you go wireless AI, I would give serious though to adding (perhaps down the road, if you want to spread the minor cost) a simple SPG as a backup. Get it on a short hose (24" or so), and it can route down your left and clip off so you'll never notice it's there unless you need it. Computers can lose their wireless link, leaving you without gas pressure info. Sure, you should know your consumption well enough to estimate, but it's good to have backup just in case. That plus a simple watch to track BT, and you have enough redundancy to get you out of a complete failure. (Complete failure is highly unlikely, more common failure is the wireless link, thus the analog backup)

Chief_Brody
09-02-2007, 00:09
If something goes wrong, or leaks, you loose everything, pressure, depth, time, everything.

Exactly my fear as newbie... and why I didn't go AI to start out.

somewhereinla
09-02-2007, 00:54
I just switch from a Suunto Vyper to an Aeris T3 AI. I absolutly love my new setup. I do still have a very small analog spg clipped to left D-ring as a back up. The T3 is really worth the money in my opinion. You can also get the T3 withoput the transmiter and save $300. You can get the computer first and then get the transmitter to make it easy on your wallet.

somewhereinla
09-02-2007, 01:00
I'll chime in here and say that I really like my Aeris Atmos ai

I clip it to my right chest D-ring, all i have to do is peek down and flip it up a bit and everything is there for me to see. It tells me my remaining dive time based on either NO2 exposure, air remaining or O2 exposure, and indicates which it is. It's small and streamlined, and nicely designed. Has the compass mounted right on top of it. like this:

http://i17.tinypic.com/4oudtle.jpg

Then when i download my dives, the pressure info at the beginning and end is recorded, pressure used is recorded, along with everything else.

Quick disconnect is a must, it just pops off and you can take it where ever.

a wrist ai computer would probably pretty sweet too, but I have no qualms with mine. I think the Atmos would be a little easier to read (larger) than a wrist if that's a concern.

This is not a very good way to set up your SPG. In an emergency this set-up would make it more difficult for rescuers to remove your BC in the water. I would advice you to check with a DM or an instructor for a better configuration. The right shoulder D-ring would be the most obvious choice combine with shortening the SPG hose for ultimate trim..

Aussie
09-02-2007, 06:13
I'll chime in here and say that I really like my Aeris Atmos ai

I clip it to my right chest D-ring, all i have to do is peek down and flip it up a bit and everything is there for me to see. It tells me my remaining dive time based on either NO2 exposure, air remaining or O2 exposure, and indicates which it is. It's small and streamlined, and nicely designed. Has the compass mounted right on top of it. like this:

http://i17.tinypic.com/4oudtle.jpg

Then when i download my dives, the pressure info at the beginning and end is recorded, pressure used is recorded, along with everything else.

Quick disconnect is a must, it just pops off and you can take it where ever.

a wrist ai computer would probably pretty sweet too, but I have no qualms with mine. I think the Atmos would be a little easier to read (larger) than a wrist if that's a concern.

This is not a very good way to set up your SPG. In an emergency this set-up would make it more difficult for rescuers to remove your BC in the water. I would advice you to check with a DM or an instructor for a better configuration. The right shoulder D-ring would be the most obvious choice combine with shortening the SPG hose for ultimate trim..

Not as difficult to remove than a diver with one peice of webbing through their Backplate.
My choice would be the left waist D-ring with correct hose length. But I believe in whatever works for you as a rule.

Aussie

Aussie
09-02-2007, 06:24
I have own and used a Suunto Transmitter for 2 years now. I use it on my single cylinder rig (BPW) with Zeagle DSV. I dive with a Suunto D9 and Suunto Vytec and have them both paired when diving. I also have a Halycon brass/glass SPG. I believe it is foolish to not dive with a good analogue SPG (glass/brass). Electronics dont exactly work well when they come into contact with water.

Looking back, I would not have purchased the transmitter as I honestly dont think that it worth the extra money to have your cylinder presure on your computer. I should of spent the money on another computer with the same algorithm as backup.

Aussie

Capt Hook
09-02-2007, 07:03
I use a non-AI wrist computer. Just can't justify the expense of an AI.

Zenagirl
09-02-2007, 07:30
I have to agree with Somewhereinla on this one, though ultimately everyone should configure their gear however they want. I used to clip my computer across my body as well, but after taking Rescue, I moved it so it doesn't cross the centerline anymore.

cummings66
09-02-2007, 18:08
All things considered I dont believe it's a problem if it's across the chest. You could easily tell it's there and unclip it, would only take a couple seconds and you'll be far busier taking the rest of the gear off anyhow.

I'd say let it stay if that's where he likes it.

Somebody that said something about the one piece straps being hard to take off in comparison, well, if you know how it's faster to remove one of those than it is a regular BC. I showed my buddy how to get mine off, took all of 4 seconds to remove my BC. Took much longer for his because I had to unclip the chest strap, waist strap and then undo the velcro holding things together.

A BP/W is so simple in comparison. People float right out of them once you undo the crotch strap which doesn't take long, assuming it's not too tight and you have to struggle to get it loose. I keep mine a bit larger so that its just a matter of opening the latch and pulling the buckle through the crotch strap loop, then float me out. Fast and easy.

Getting back on point, the computer won't slow down the process much no matter how it's done.

3rdEye
09-02-2007, 22:42
I'll chime in here and say that I really like my Aeris Atmos ai

I clip it to my right chest D-ring, all i have to do is peek down and flip it up a bit and everything is there for me to see. It tells me my remaining dive time based on either NO2 exposure, air remaining or O2 exposure, and indicates which it is. It's small and streamlined, and nicely designed. Has the compass mounted right on top of it. like this:

http://i17.tinypic.com/4oudtle.jpg

Then when i download my dives, the pressure info at the beginning and end is recorded, pressure used is recorded, along with everything else.

Quick disconnect is a must, it just pops off and you can take it where ever.

a wrist ai computer would probably pretty sweet too, but I have no qualms with mine. I think the Atmos would be a little easier to read (larger) than a wrist if that's a concern.

This is not a very good way to set up your SPG. In an emergency this set-up would make it more difficult for rescuers to remove your BC in the water. I would advice you to check with a DM or an instructor for a better configuration. The right shoulder D-ring would be the most obvious choice combine with shortening the SPG hose for ultimate trim..


some divers wrap a 7' reg hose across the body and around the neck...

anyway, it's attached with a bolt snap, pretty simple to unhook, and also has a quick release that can be undone in a fraction of a second as well....but, you're right, something to consider. I guess in theory I could connect it to a HP port on the other side to keep it on my right D ring

fire diver
09-02-2007, 22:55
3rdeye, just use a bit of string to connect the computer to the bolt snap. If it needs to come off quick, it can be yanked free.

FD

Travelnsj
09-02-2007, 23:48
I have two AI's the D9 and the Cobra....love the Cobra jury is still out on the D9 because of the paring issues.

Aussie
09-03-2007, 05:21
I have two AI's the D9 and the Cobra....love the Cobra jury is still out on the D9 because of the paring issues.

When the Cobra dies during the dive then what? Bit like having a sportscar with no spare tyre when diving with no analogue SPG.

Aussie

Krakenn
09-03-2007, 05:55
When the Cobra dies you come up

Kraks

Aussie
09-03-2007, 06:41
When the Cobra dies you come up

Kraks

Then you buy a Brass/Glass SPG. Sell cobra on ebay to some newbie. Right mate?

Aussie

Travelnsj
09-03-2007, 09:43
I have two AI's the D9 and the Cobra....love the Cobra jury is still out on the D9 because of the paring issues.

When the Cobra dies during the dive then what? Bit like having a sportscar with no spare tyre when diving with no analogue SPG.

Aussie

Good point....I should have a third redundant device...never had a problem in all my diving with the Cobra....but once is too much.

Aussie
09-03-2007, 17:57
I have two AI's the D9 and the Cobra....love the Cobra jury is still out on the D9 because of the paring issues.

When the Cobra dies during the dive then what? Bit like having a sportscar with no spare tyre when diving with no analogue SPG.

Aussie

Good point....I should have a third redundant device...never had a problem in all my diving with the Cobra....but once is too much.

I have killed a few Suuntos. 3 Mosquitos and 2 D9's. Died during a dive. So I am not keen on the Cobra as my primary gauge.

Thats my opinion anyway.

Aussie

Travelnsj
09-03-2007, 18:29
I have two AI's the D9 and the Cobra....love the Cobra jury is still out on the D9 because of the paring issues.

When the Cobra dies during the dive then what? Bit like having a sportscar with no spare tyre when diving with no analogue SPG.

Aussie

Good point....I should have a third redundant device...never had a problem in all my diving with the Cobra....but once is too much.

I have killed a few Suuntos. 3 Mosquitos and 2 D9's. Died during a dive. So I am not keen on the Cobra as my primary gauge.

Thats my opinion anyway.

Aussie

More than an opinion...strong advice!....have a redundant gauage if you have AI's.

thesmoothdome
09-03-2007, 19:14
I dive a cobra and don't carry a redundant gauge. Regardless of AI or not, if the computer takes a dump, the dive is over. Since I'm careful about knowing how much gas I have left, do I really need a redundant gauge to surface with? For the record, I've never had a computer die mid-dive on me.

Manny-R
09-03-2007, 20:24
if any dive computer dies under water... AI or not, call the dive, go to the boat, and get ready for the next dive...

thesmoothdome
09-03-2007, 20:34
if any dive computer dies under water... AI or not, call the dive, go to the boat, and get ready for the next dive...


problem there is if you've been making repetative dives, you have no idea how much residual nitrogen you've built up. You're pretty much out of the water for 24-48 hours if your only computer takes a dump in that situation.

Aussie
09-03-2007, 22:34
I am diving with two computers, Suunto D9 and Vytec. I also have an old Aladin pro.

I believe diving with two computers is important especially on a long liveaboard. 5 dives a day with 100 minutes a dive soon adds up on a computer. Recommend the same brand or Algorithm for both computers.

I picked up the Vytec off ebay very cheap so the extra cost isnt an issue.

If one dies you have the other with all your data in it.

Makes sense to me.:smiley20:

Aussie

ianr33
09-03-2007, 22:45
My $.02

Get a simple wrist mounted nitrox computer. Dive it enough so that you know it backwards. Understand if it is liberal or conservative.
Understand rock bottom turn pressures and make your own decisions.Dont trust that to some outsourced programmers !

Put the cash you save towards an exotic dive trip somewhere.

Krakenn
09-04-2007, 00:01
Aussie, how the hell did you ruin so many dive computers?
I was thinking you should change your name to 'Lucky' pal.

I always watch my air and if the comp went I would head for the boat mind you most of the dives I do are shallow between 10-30m if I was consistently diving below that perhaps I would invest in a second gauge.

I was intending to go for a wrist mount Atom 2 and to retire the Cobra but my mates that have wrist mounted AI say they can be a pain when you wear 5mm gloves consistently.

So Ive decided just to sit tight and wait for the Cobra to blow up!

Kraks

Kraks

brandon
09-04-2007, 00:21
Want an AI computer on the cheap?

Buy a secondhand Cobra - paid $300 for mine last year and haven't looked back. 100+ dives and she's still ticking.

They're easy to find on Scubaboard and Ebay.

-Brandon.

Manny-R
09-04-2007, 05:46
if any dive computer dies under water... AI or not, call the dive, go to the boat, and get ready for the next dive...


problem there is if you've been making repetative dives, you have no idea how much residual nitrogen you've built up. You're pretty much out of the water for 24-48 hours if your only computer takes a dump in that situation.


well then, in that case, you are right, no back-up, stay dry for the time it would take to be 100% safe, and look into another computer/ fixing the broken one etc...

Aussie
09-04-2007, 05:58
Aussie, how the hell did you ruin so many dive computers?
I was thinking you should change your name to 'Lucky' pal.

I always watch my air and if the comp went I would head for the boat mind you most of the dives I do are shallow between 10-30m if I was consistently diving below that perhaps I would invest in a second gauge.

I was intending to go for a wrist mount Atom 2 and to retire the Cobra but my mates that have wrist mounted AI say they can be a pain when you wear 5mm gloves consistently.

So Ive decided just to sit tight and wait for the Cobra to blow up!

Kraks

Kraks

Kraks I put it down to doing lots of diving. Nothing really deep or really long (30m max for 60min max).
The Suunto Mosquitos are easy to kill. They normally last 200-250 dives before they die. Made for the diver that only does a few dives each year.

The D9 I put down to having one of the first ones out. As you know it had "issues" with its program and it had to be sent back to Finland to be re-programed. Then It had another recall from the factory and had to be sent back for more re-programing. After all of this it died during a dive and was sent back and they replace the internal computer. After all this hassle they wouldnt send me a brand new one, cause i would have sold it and bought a VR3 instead. So I will keep diving with my Suuntos until they die and replace with something like the VR3.

I have the Vytec on a Deepdivesupply bungee strap and I think they are great bit of kit. I can understand why 5mm gloves are hard with smaller wrist computers.

Aussie

Krakenn
09-04-2007, 07:08
Aus, what do you do for a crust m8?
Im assuming you own a dive shop or your with Sydney Water Police?

Either that or your corp exec?

Kraks

Aussie
09-04-2007, 08:09
Aus, what do you do for a crust m8?
Im assuming you own a dive shop or your with Sydney Water Police?

Either that or your corp exec?

Kraks

Narr,

Just spend all spare cash on diving gear or underwater camera gear.

Maybe Corp Exec that owns a chain of dive shops and has the Water police on the payroll...........:smilie39:

I wish.

Aussie

subsur
09-04-2007, 14:49
what are your priorities - save some money or get what's best for you? if you want to save money, then it's easy, get an SPG and non-AI wrist computer or console computer attached to a HP port. what's best for you - it's a transient concept - depends on your diving habits / environment, your personal style and even your aesthetical values. you may not need Nitrox now but in a year you may want to have that feature on a computer. you may want to go into tech diving (or not). if money is not an issue - get the computer that does everything.

Krakenn
09-05-2007, 05:11
What sought of cameras do you have?

Kraks

Aussie
09-05-2007, 07:07
What sought of cameras do you have?

Kraks

I am now on a Nikon D80 in a Ikelite housing with twin Ikelite Strobes. Weather is crap over here at the moment and i actually posted a few recent dive pics. My macro is improving by the day and I just recieved my fisheye/wideangle this week.

Aussie

Krakenn
09-06-2007, 04:23
I see you went the cheaper option Aus? - Smiles!

No D70 left? - How do you like the D80?

Kenn

Aussie
09-06-2007, 17:56
I see you went the cheaper option Aus? - Smiles!

No D70 left? - How do you like the D80?

Kenn

The cheap option:smilie39:

I love it. Except it has SD memory instead of CF. Now all my CF cards are useless. Battery life of 1500 shots.
I was looking at the D200 but couldnt justify the extra $500+. Spent the money on lenses and saving for the replacement of the D80 in 3 years.lol.

Looking for a pelican or storm case for it.............$500.....:smiley19:

more money

My mate and I buy lotto tickets each week. One day. Endless dive trip and money towards becoming a power-ranger lookalike.

Aussie

Krakenn
09-08-2007, 00:15
At the end of the day, I would still support the use of AI computer for 99% of recreational divers. To continue to add redundancy systems to your gear, in my opinion is making the sport over complicated. If you need it that badly you are probably diving in areas beyong the capability of most Rec Divers anyway.

But that is only one opinion of course.

I guess I like the keep it simple principles that I was always taught;

Dont hold your breathe when you come up
Dont go too deep for too long
Asend with your smallest bubbles.
Tell mum you love her when you go diving!

Kraks

Aussie
09-08-2007, 00:47
Keep it Simple S (KISS)

Non AI is the simple option. Glass/Brass SPG.
No batteries need. No need to pair. Cheap. Easy to read.

Used for 100% of every type of diving you can think of.

Aussie

Krakenn
09-08-2007, 01:04
Hmm

I just brought my wife a Airlab from ST because the dive master at Cape Dive in Dunsborough wouldnt allow her to do a wreck dive on HMAS Swan without a computer.

Funny world isnt it!

Kraks

divechaplain-sara
09-08-2007, 01:12
Mine is not AI. I have an Aeris XR2 which I got in the spring. I like it so far, but I'm still just learning. Air integrated would have been nice, but I like a wrist computer and couldn't afford the remote AI at this point, but I'm sure glad I had the computer for my liveaboard trip to the Flower Gardens. When I get other debts paid off and have time to dive more, I hope to have an AI computer and keep this one as a back up.

ianr33
09-08-2007, 09:40
I hope to have an AI computer and keep this one as a back up.

What advantage do you see in an AI computer?

divechaplain-sara
09-08-2007, 13:58
I hope to have an AI computer and keep this one as a back up.

What advantage do you see in an AI computer?

I'm planning to do the wireless AI when I eventually go that route and to keep my gauges for redundancy. I like the idea of having all my info in one place and I want that on my wrist--much more convenient to me. But all those changes are several years away. I've been diving for 5 years and just got my bc, reg, and computer this year. A camera upgrade is in the works before the computer change and paying off my car is ahead of both of those.

Charles R
09-08-2007, 14:45
:smiley20:personal opion I prefer no AI wrist computer and a SPG

Kidder
09-08-2007, 15:14
I hope to have an AI computer and keep this one as a back up.

What advantage do you see in an AI computer?

I have a Oceanic VT3. It is awesome. recently I dove with my buddy who wore a VT pro and was able to buddy check his air. I still keep my gauges, but with my air on my wrist it is easier. Just to look at it while I'm checking my depth etc...

jo8243
09-17-2007, 16:10
I think the most reliable way is to go with a wristmount/clipped computer and then have a small spg/depth clipped off to the waist. The computer is right there when you need it --- and so will be the SPG if the computer fails..

This is the setup I have. Wristmount is great, and if you're willing to sacrifice the AI part it's a LOT cheaper. It's no big deal to have a SPG to look at. They are so small nowdays it's no biggie. You don't need to look at your SPG as often as your depth, IMO, anyway.

SynCitizen
11-02-2008, 10:01
I just got and used for the first time my cobra AI and really liked it. Maybe because I dont have a ton of experience yet, I find it is pretty cool to monitor air consumption in real time and work on improving it with instant feed back. Plus once I had the dive downloaded I can get an idea with the graphing how various circumstances affected me mid dive. (dropped a weight pouch and could see right where my air consumption spiked slightly)