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View Full Version : Valid rant, or my imagination



dvinnola
11-26-2008, 11:10
I was reading through a copy of Scuba Diving magazine, and they had an article about 'top gear of 2008' or something. There is not on Zeagle product mentioned. Now, I am a new diver (only 25 dives) and I only have 2 Zeagle products (brigade and SMB), so I am not a gear expert. I am not naive either. I know advertising plays a big role. So, my question is this: Does Zeagle not have a piece of gear in the tops for 2008, or did they not release anything new in 2008 (was 2007 a banner year), or does Scuba Diving just rate the companies that advertise?

awap
11-26-2008, 11:23
Scuba Diving magazine should be used with caution. They are not an unbiased source of much of the information they present. It may just mean that Zeagle did not pay them enough for such an advertisement.

fireflock
11-26-2008, 11:29
Scuba Diving magazine should be used with caution. They are not an unbiased source of much of the information they present. It may just mean that Zeagle did not pay them enough for such an advertisement.

I know where this attitude comes from, but I don't think it's true for this mag these days.

The rankings can be subjective, and they really favor new products. I bet some of the stuff Zeagle introduced at DEMA last month will make next years list.

Rich

MSilvia
11-26-2008, 12:14
Whatever the reasons Zeagle wasn't included, Scuba Diving magazine's "Top Gear" articles are only representative of their opinions of the gear they looked at, and shouldn't be considered authoratative or exhaustive.

There's a lot of good gear that doesn't get much mention there.

dvinnola
11-26-2008, 12:23
I guess that is what I was getting at. If there is a new diver (me) looking to get some new gear (which I have to do), and I read that magazine, I would not be looking at Zeagle at all. The advice here of course is that everyone should look to multiple sources of information, but if I didn't find ST by accident, and that the people at my LDS weren't tools, and I trusted the magazine to do the legwork for me, I would not have a Brigade. It just seems like a "best gear" feature would include gear from all top brands. I live in a land-locked state where it is hard to demo gear, so I really need to be able to trust what I read.

Oh well, I know this isn't a new problem, and certainly not limited to dive mags. I just think brands like Zeagle should get some "air time", based on the limited products I own.

raider11
11-26-2008, 13:47
Ive read a lot of reviews from Scuba Diving Mag and always had the same feeling you have... they either not list Zeagle products or they do but are not fair.

Largo
11-26-2008, 14:29
They also completely ignore Tusa Zoom split fins.

Zenagirl
11-26-2008, 14:51
Remember that the magazine isn't a "Consumer Reports" type of magazine that buys the products they test. I'd lay odds that they only "review" the equipment that manufacturers send them for free.

fireflock
11-26-2008, 15:20
They have purchased some gear in the past, when manufacturers didn't want to submit gear and readers wanted the brands in the tests. I do think that they get most of the gear direct from manufacturers though.

ScottZeagle has posted a little bit about the process from his perspective over the years:
ScubaBoard - View Single Post - Zeagle BC magazine writeups/reviews? (http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/2121741-post14.html)

Some of the Zeagle regs constantly get a best buy rating, FWIW.

You can also find some insight here (from people who do or don't buys ads and have their gear reviewed):
Questions about ScubaDiving.com?? - ScubaBoard (http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/basic-scuba-discussions/123635-questions-about-scubadiving-com.html)

teerlkay
11-26-2008, 16:55
every once in a while they also get in a pi$$ing contest with a manufacturer and stop testing their gear for awhile

in_cavediver
11-26-2008, 21:41
I look at the 'scubalabs' with a grain of salt. They are not consumer reports and have a bias. Either that, or I am just too opiniated myself. I also fall outside thier target demographic.

Needless to say, Zeagle to me is a good company and their gear is flexible. From the warm tropical waters to entry level tec stuff - its all good stuff.

Splitlip
11-26-2008, 21:58
Got to do your due diligence Bro.

Zeagle has had a number of top ranked products over the years. The mag cannot and does not test every product out there every year. Yes, presumably they "invite" the big advertisors first.

You need to be a smart consumer. Go back a year or two and look at he non subjective reviews.

As was said, they are not Consumer Reports. And although I am a fan of a lot of Zeagle products, they should not be presumed to be the best of everything for everybody.

pollywog
11-27-2008, 08:53
Any research you ever do on any product will have to come from more than one source. Reading a SCUBA mag does not an expert make. I have found that these forums, in conjunction with talking to other divers, talking to my instructor, and doing my own homework online, are excellent sources of info. No one source is infallible. It's just like training in martial arts, or anywhere, for that matter. Look for the good, as an example. Look for the bad, as a warning. Consider your source. You just have to remember that these mags are like any other business, they are out to make a buck. Why would they give away free advertising? At the end of the day, I don't think product info backed by a business(whose biz is magazine selling) is a valid source of info.

shawnwill36
11-28-2008, 11:55
im sure they have alterier motives

gbrdiver
11-30-2008, 06:51
When I started Tech diving, I just asked everyone what about their personal views on what gear was best. Sure there were some pretty emotive responses but in the end I went with Zeagle. Best move I made. My buddies spent heaps on other junk, but they're coming on board now! I like scuba diving mag, and I like there reviews, but I would never buy soley on there advice.

ScottZeagle
12-01-2008, 08:59
Scuba Diving Magazine sends out a list of things that they will be reviewing every year, so that manufacturers can plan ahead to have product ready to ship.

For example, Dec. 1st was the deadline for "New BCs", which will be featured in the April '09 issue. We have quite a few "new BCs" this year, but I don't expect the magazine to test and review all of them, so we send them a few and hope that maybe 2 of them get reviewed...

The magazine reviews give an overview of the products and hopefully drive the consumer to search out more info...and hopefully they end of on one of the forums to get some real world feedback from people who use the product on a regular basis.

mrm777
12-01-2008, 23:20
"...hopefully they end of on one of the forums to get some real world feedback from people who use the product on a regular basis."
________________________
Good guideline for anyone considering scuba purchase(s).



.

dvinnola
12-03-2008, 15:30
I think that is the point. This forum, or one like scubaboard, contain a ton of useful information and experiences which a magazine cannot match. However, read the article. It doesn't say "this is the top gear of 2008 THAT WE HAVE RECEIVED FROM VENDORS", it just says "top gear of 2008", right on the cover.

Buyer beware, right?

This "hobby" is going to drive me nuts. I bought the Brigade, and have used it twice now, but came across the whole BP/W concept recently. Now I am wondering if I went the wrong direction. Oh well. Thanks for helping to center my thoughts.

Zenagirl
12-03-2008, 16:32
The Brigade is just as modular as a BP/W, the major difference is that you can get heavy or light back plates. Whatever you do, make sure you try a BP/W before you buy one, like everything else, they aren't for everyone (no matter what you might hear). And yes, I've tried one and didn't like it at all.

BSea
12-03-2008, 17:00
I think that is the point. This forum, or one like scubaboard, contain a ton of useful information and experiences which a magazine cannot match. However, read the article. It doesn't say "this is the top gear of 2008 THAT WE HAVE RECEIVED FROM VENDORS", it just says "top gear of 2008", right on the cover.

Buyer beware, right?

This "hobby" is going to drive me nuts. I bought the Brigade, and have used it twice now, but came across the whole BP/W concept recently. Now I am wondering if I went the wrong direction. Oh well. Thanks for helping to center my thoughts.I'll tell you my experience. I too bought a brigade. I really like most things about it. I got the trim pockets in the back which I think are essential. 2 tank straps are better than one. Very modular as many people have noted. Things I didn't like were the pockets. IMHO I found them to be almost useless. I don't think it packed very well for trips. But all in all a better than most BC. I then heard about this BP/W bc & started researching. I decided that I would piece together a BP/W setup to try & keep the cost down. The only thing I splurged on was an Oxycheq signature wing (this was before the Mach V). My intent was that I'd have the brigade as a backup, or to use when I thought it would make the better choice. After 6 months, the brigade never came out of the closet. So I ended up selling it on E-Bay. If you have the chance, try one out. But be prepared to make a few dives before you get it dialed in. All in all, I couldn't be happier with my BP/W.

But as with all opinions, this one comes with no warranty.:smiley20:

dvinnola
12-03-2008, 17:27
Crap, I figured after doing the "deep dive", so to speak, on the forum about the BP/W.