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View Full Version : If San Francisco was the next New Orleans...



Hemlon
08-31-2007, 21:51
If San Francisco had an earthquake that was an devastating as Katrina was to New Orleans, would the nation rally around San Francisco?

It's been two years since Katrina hit NoLa and we're still seeing tv ads asking for help. (I saw one on tv tonight from Tide detergent...if you buy a Tide retro t-shirt, the proceeds go to help rebuild NoLa homes.)

But it made me wonder if the country would rally around San Fran if it was suddenly devastated.

Would we think that our help wasn't as needed because San Fran isn't as poor of a city as NoLa?

Would we feel justified to not donate to charity because Californians are stereotypically over-educated, over-paid, wine-loving hippies? Where as Louisianians are stereotypically poor, uneducated minorities?

georoc01
08-31-2007, 21:58
IT took over a decade for SF to rebuild from Loma Prieta, and that wasn't nearly as devasting as earlier quakes.

And yes, I think SF would be just as bad because the politics in that city and state are as bad as they are in NOLA.

What would be a more interesting example would be say New York or Washington DC. After 9/11, there was quite the rally behind those cities.

Suther2136
08-31-2007, 22:02
East Texas is still a mess as well...and we're not even as important as NOLA

Hemlon
08-31-2007, 22:06
East Texas is still a mess as well...and we're not even as important as NOLA

Bingo!

Why do you think that was/is the case?

Suther2136
08-31-2007, 22:08
Cuz nobody cares about the boonies. Our church spent months in east texas helping out folks that needed alift.

scuba Widow
08-31-2007, 23:20
I am sure that the initial response would be the same but would eventfully fall to the way side. Like every other rally in America after a disaster. Do I think that New Orleans still needs help, maybe but there are just as many people in others areas that need help to. I watch the news and the recent weather related problems are not as well publicized as the aftermath of Katrina. I think that the problem lies with people not wanting to help themselves.

I watched the news day in and day out after Katrina and saw people standing there screaming for help and saying how unfair it was that this was happening to them,but you know what life is not fair. On the other hand, I saw people walking trying to get to safety and dealing with what life has dealt them. It has been 2 years since the hurricane and the people of New Orleans are still looking for a handout. The other areas that were hit by Katrina have moved on.

The New Orleans area acts like they are the only ones that has been devastated by a natural or manmade disaster. I can come up with alot of other areas that are in ruins do to similar things. The state of Florida, for example was devastated by back to back hurricanes. If you visit there you still find destroyed buildings and blue tarps on the roofs of homes, but they are surviving.

I think that Americans need to rally and give the residents of areas that are victimized by disasters a hand up not a hand out, because the more help you give the more they take. Give them the essentials to get back on their feet and make they work to achieve the rest.

creggur
09-01-2007, 07:07
I am sure that the initial response would be the same but would eventfully fall to the way side. Like every other rally in America after a disaster. Do I think that New Orleans still needs help, maybe but there are just as many people in others areas that need help to. I watch the news and the recent weather related problems are not as well publicized as the aftermath of Katrina. I think that the problem lies with people not wanting to help themselves.

I watched the news day in and day out after Katrina and saw people standing there screaming for help and saying how unfair it was that this was happening to them,but you know what life is not fair. On the other hand, I saw people walking trying to get to safety and dealing with what life has dealt them. It has been 2 years since the hurricane and the people of New Orleans are still looking for a handout. The other areas that were hit by Katrina have moved on.

The New Orleans area acts like they are the only ones that has been devastated by a natural or manmade disaster. I can come up with alot of other areas that are in ruins do to similar things. The state of Florida, for example was devastated by back to back hurricanes. If you visit there you still find destroyed buildings and blue tarps on the roofs of homes, but they are surviving.

I think that Americans need to rally and give the residents of areas that are victimized by disasters a hand up not a hand out, because the more help you give the more they take. Give them the essentials to get back on their feet and make they work to achieve the rest.

This is probably the most thoughtful and accurate things I've ever read on this board...In my opinion you are right on!!!:smiley20:

gtjason2000
09-01-2007, 08:22
San Francisco was already leveled by a earthquake and rebuilt albeit 100 years ago.

Hemlon
09-01-2007, 08:25
San Francisco was already leveled by a earthquake and rebuilt albeit 100 years ago.

Yes, most of us are aware of the 1906 earthquake. Do you have an opinion about the question I posted at the beginning of this thread?

scubasamurai
09-01-2007, 08:38
buy property in neveda and you will have shore front soon enough after the next earthquake and CA falls into the ocean. you guys have to watch old superman reruns between dives

PlatypusMan
09-01-2007, 09:01
I think that the problem lies with people not wanting to help themselves...

... It has been 2 years since the hurricane and the people of New Orleans are still looking for a handout. The other areas that were hit by Katrina have moved on.

...The New Orleans area acts like they are the only ones that has been devastated by a natural or manmade disaster.

I lived for five years in New Orleans, so I believe I have a unique insight into this.

The culture in New Orleans, or for that matter much of Louisiana, has been shaped by the political machines of the state and the city that put laws and programs into effect in the early part of the 20th century. The natural result of all of this is that you have a culture of victimhood and entitlement that will never go away. In order to buy votes, politicians in Louisiana have long made it possible for certain groups and the politically connected to feed at the public trough long hard and deep.

I liken it to ancient Rome; once the populace discovers that it can vote itself Bread and Circuses, it will continue to do so until the treasury is emptied with drunken abandon. Once the sack of the public funds has been completed, the people stand around scratching their heads going "what happened?" -- and, "who's going to take care of us now?"

Now, this is not an indictment of all the people of the State of Louisiana, nor in New Orleans in particular -- there are hard-working, hard-charging people in that state who are doing their best to dig themselves out from under. Unfortunately, in my opinion, they are few and far between.

Hemlon
09-01-2007, 09:14
Well said, Platypus!

greyzen
09-01-2007, 09:23
I was professionally involved with Louisiana during Katrina. The feeling of victimization and charitable cases really was very strong months and months after any possible claims. I had a women living in Houston, something like nine-months after the hurricane, try to position herself for special comps due to Katrina. Now, I'm not a coldhearted jerk-off, but she was using corporate assets that were damaged by non flood related things, and asking for freebies due to the fact she was a refugee.

Now, I personally was involved with replacements/repairs for around 9mil to the survivors, so it wasn't like I did nothing... but I still looked at each case as individual and not some giant "Oh well, you know the troubles they had".

I think it's very telling that the state of Louisiana has 0 credit line with several corporations. (they have to pay with checks that clear before stuff will be sent to them, no other state has this restriction)

Kingpatzer
09-01-2007, 09:31
NOLA was not a victim of a hurricane. NOLA was a victim of an incompetent and corrupt local and state government, and a a completely mis-managed federal response.

There is only so much you can do to "help yourself" when there is no working government or community infrastructure to allow you to succeed.

Just one example -- they dredged out the port at the height of shrimping season -- destroying an already down harvest for the shrimpers of NOLA, who had already lost tons due to the hurricanes the previous year. How can you pull yourself up by your own bootstraps when the government is doing everything they can to cut those straps out of your hands?

Other areas have come back better because they have local and state governments that are less corrupt and more responsive.

It's not the people looking for hand-outs. It's the people looking for the same level of help that places like Florida or North Carolina have gotten after similar events. But that help can never get to the people because the state and local officials are corrupt and misguided.

A big difference. In my state, the State DA office actively initiates and pursues lawsuites against insurance companies to ensure that the insurance companies expeditiously make good on their policies. They also use the power of the executive branch to license insurance companies in the state to badger companies to do the right thing. In LA, the state DA office sits it out and lets the individuals fight their own fights against the insurance companies. The result is predictable, and is hardly the fault of the individuals.

Hemlon
09-01-2007, 09:46
I've had two encounters with post-Katrina transplants. While they were different, they had a common thread: the quest to manipulate the system.

The first one was a middle-aged woman came in for the surgical repair of a fractured arm. This was her second surgery for this fracture. In the recovery room, she was awake and talking to me about what had happened.

She had moved to Austin shortly after Katrina. She told a terrible tale of living on busses for days after the Superdome was evacuated. One of the Austin churches took her, her two adult children and several of her grandchildren into their home as a host family until they could get back on their feet.

The host family fed, clothed and gave shelter to the refugee family for 2 months. One night, while getting out of bed, the woman (whom we were doing surgery on) fell while getting out of bed. Her radius and ulna were fractured. The first surgery stabilized the injury and the subsequent surgery (where I met her) was for a more permanent treatment.

So when I had her in the recovery room, she told me this whole story and how the bed that she fell out of just wasn't safe because it wasn't tall enough to compensate for her osteoarthritis.

While still living at the host family's house, she demanded that they pay for her medical bills. The host family suggested that she seek public medical assistance (Medicaid) but the woman became upset and (ready for the kicker???) sued the host family.

She moved out of the host family's home shortly afterward. When I met the woman, her case was still pending in court per her account.

Un-freaking-believable.

scuba Widow
09-01-2007, 09:47
I was professionally involved with Louisiana during Katrina. The feeling of victimization and charitable cases really was very strong months and months after any possible claims. I had a women living in Houston, something like nine-months after the hurricane, try to position herself for special comps due to Katrina. Now, I'm not a coldhearted jerk-off, but she was using corporate assets that were damaged by non flood related things, and asking for freebies due to the fact she was a refugee.

Now, I personally was involved with replacements/repairs for around 9mil to the survivors, so it wasn't like I did nothing... but I still looked at each case as individual and not some giant "Oh well, you know the troubles they had".

I think it's very telling that the state of Louisiana has 0 credit line with several corporations. (they have to pay with checks that clear before stuff will be sent to them, no other state has this restriction)

I don't think that you coldhearted at all you have a job to do and people like that are stealing from people who really need it. My husband and I have talked about the problems of New Orleans and how much the general public has had to pay for on account of the hurricane. We all pay in so many ways from the donations to the price of food and I personally don't want to pay for someone to abuse the system anymore than I already do with the welfare system the way it is. I agree that each case has to be looked at as an individual and not in a general sense.

I am watching a movie called "Tornado" on sci-fi this morning and I just mentioned to my husband a point that I think needs to be mentioned here.
The folks of New Orleans had a chance to evacuate the area as you do with all hurricanes, but when something like a tornado, earthquake, terrorist attack happens you generally don't. As adults, you have to take responsibility for your own lives and if that means moving to a safe area to live or even just leave until the danger passes, you do so. I have friends at work that have said that they feel sorry more for the children than anybody...while I do feel sorry for the children, you have to blame the adults in charge for not taking care of their families and making sure everybody was safe.

scubasamurai
09-01-2007, 09:53
sorry but what i truely hate is the "stars" that tell us we should do more while they sit in the comfort of their million dollar estates, praising what good deeds they did for post katrinia victims. the true stars are the people that are down in the trenches digging through that mess trying to rebuild or the people living in the small trailers. granted some people play the system, but others are just plain tired and want to get on with their lives.
so to those tv personalities, the ones that build homes in other states instead of building the homes where people want to live. get or your butt and do something rigth.
just tired of it.

scuba Widow
09-01-2007, 09:55
I've had two encounters with post-Katrina transplants. While they were different, they had a common thread: the quest to manipulate the system.

The first one was a middle-aged woman came in for the surgical repair of a fractured arm. This was her second surgery for this fracture. In the recovery room, she was awake and talking to me about what had happened.

She had moved to Austin shortly after Katrina. She told a terrible tale of living on busses for days after the Superdome was evaculated. One of the Austin churches took her, her two adult children and several of her grandchildren into their home as a host family until they could get back on their feet.

The host family fed, clothed and gave shelter to the refugee family for 2 months. One night, while getting out of bed, the woman (whom we were doing surgery on) fell while getting out of bed. Her radius and ulna were fractured. The first surgery stabilized the injury and the subsequent surgery (where I met her) was for a more permanent treatment.

So when I had her in the recovery room, she told me this whole story and how the bed that she fell out of just wasn't safe because it wasn't tall enough to compensate for her osteoarthritis.

While still living at the host family's house, she demanded that they pay for her medical bills. The host family suggested that she seek public medical assistance (Medicaid) but the woman became upset and (ready for the kicker???) sued the host family.

She moved out of the host family's home shortly afterward. When I met the woman, her case was still pending in court per her account.

Un-freaking-believable.

You know what they say no good deed goes unpunished.