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buddha0724
11-04-2010, 11:40
I recently got diagnosed with low testosterone while undergoing some tests to see why my wife and I havent been able to have a little buddha.

Now before ScubaStud says it, EVERYTHING WORKS!:smiley20:

What I am wondering is if anyone has had any personal experience with testosterone treatment. I know there are pro's and cons. I have talked with my doc and got his info, now I am looking for some from you guys.

Anyone have any info that could help?

Thanks everyone!

scubadiver888
11-04-2010, 12:15
I had low testosterone. Doctor put me on steroids. Every so often I'd come in for a check up. They'd do blood work. At first they were monitoring total testosterone and we got some wanky numbers. Then she started measuring total and free testosterone. After a year of being on the steroids I was at a point were I was building back muscle. I also worked with her to change my diet as well (this was the ultimate cause of the problem).

All my doctors (and this is why I see them and not others) believe in using medication as a temporary solution. They look for more holistic reasons for the problems. Once we can put more nature cures in place we cut back or eliminate the need for medication.

Straegen
11-04-2010, 12:54
See an Endo if you haven't before moving forward is my suggestion. I had (have) the same condition. I went through the typical battery of tests to discover why since it can be an indicator of a much more serious issue. I ended up moving away from drugs but I wasn't under any time pressure such as having kids. By getting healthier in other places in my life, my levels have gone back into the "normal" range but remain on the lower end of the scale.

scubadiver888
11-04-2010, 14:21
I forgot to mention, my doctor knows my wife and I were not working on kids. So if there are any issues relating to having kids, she wouldn't have mentioned them.

If has been a few years since I was on replacement therapy but a few more things came back to me...

I believe my lab measures the levels in nanograms/litre (ng/l). You might be using a different unit of measure. My levels were in the teens (18-19) and normal was above 30. On the steroids I was seeing levels in the fourties but symptoms persisted. She switched to measure the free testosterone at that point and found it low. She doubled my dose for 6 months and started to see improvements. I was taking Andriol, an oral anabolic steroid. I don't remember the dosage but she didn't want me overdoing it. So we started slow, waited 6 months, checked and adjusted, waited 6 months, and so on.

Improvements were hit or miss over the next few check ups but then at the next increase my free testosterone doubled. Stayed at that level for a year with diet changes. When I was feeling good I just quit taking the Andriol. My levels have fluctuated a little over the years but have remained within normal ranges.

buddha0724
11-04-2010, 15:21
Thanks for all of the responses. From what we talked about at the docs (not an Endo) for a male my age the average is around 668 and the normal range is 300 to 1100. I came in at 270 so not to far out of normal but quite a ways from average.

What type of diet changes did you do that worked? I dont really see much symptoms of being low but my doc pointed out some to me. Fatigue and my weight.

I saw that some possible complications from treatment is increased risk of prostrate cancer and stroke.

Natural ways would defintely be better.

Thanks guys!

brojack17
11-04-2010, 15:35
I took Testim .5mg for awhile. It seemed to help.

scubastud
11-04-2010, 17:32
buddah I hope things go good, I think you are doing the right thing, going with the less intrusive natrlal stuff...

and...

I hope everything comes out ok. :smiley20::smiley36:

alpha
11-04-2010, 18:07
I dont really see much symptoms of being low but my doc pointed out some to me. Fatigue and my weight.

Natural ways would defintely be better.


Male Hormone Restoration - Testosterone, Zinc, Chrysin - Life Extension Health Concern (http://www.lef.org/protocols/male_reproductive/male_hormone_restoration_01.htm)
One of the most important factors that affect testosterone levels of aging men is an enzyme called aromatase, which is found in fat tissue. This enzyme is responsible for converting testosterone into estrogen, thus altering the ratio of estrogen to testosterone (Steiner MS et al 2003). Men who have excessive body fat, especially abdominal fat, are likely to have increased estrogen levels caused by aromatase activity and a dramatically increased estrogen level compared to testosterone. An increased estrogen level has been linked, in turn, to a host of disorders, including decreased insulin sensitivity and blood glucose problems. Some studies suggest that there is an association between a low testosterone level, insulin resistance, an elevated estrogen level, and increased body fat in aging men (Phillips GB 1993)
-----Additional incentive to shed the pounds (diet & increase exercise).

Aging men who have an androgen deficiency experience both an increase in aromatase activity and an elevation in SHBG production. The net result is to increase the ratio of estrogen to testosterone and lower the total testosterone level (Killinger DW et al 1987; Kley HK et al 1980a,b). Finally, it is important that aging men also strive for optimal liver function. The liver is responsible for removing excess estrogen and SHBG, so any compromise in liver function (such as that caused by heavy alcohol consumption, for example) can exacerbate hormonal imbalances.
-----Keep your liver healthy to eliminate estrogen type products efficiently. Avoid excess alcohol, acetaminophen(often unnoticed in long term pain therapy), etc. that may cause liver damage.

-----No liver problems known, but this has me reconsidering my late night etoh indulgences.


-----A Huge list exists on this site referenced 5/8 of the way down the page...Sorry, but I did not want to read/post it all but link is listed above...
Natural Approaches to Boost Testosterone and Suppress Estrogen....

scubadiver888
11-04-2010, 18:12
I used to eat a lot of carbs and not the best selection of proteins. I started to eat more greens and vegetables (more fibre so I didn't feel hungry). Tried to cut back on the carbs. Started eat more lean cuts of pork and fish (mostly sashimi and nothing deep fried). Dropped around 50 pounds at first then put another 20 pounds back on but it was mostly muscle.

For the most part I was eating a lot of Taiwanese and Japanese food.

alpha
11-04-2010, 20:27
Articles: Explaining Hormones - Women Living Naturally (http://www.womenlivingnaturally.com/articlepage.php?id=35) interesting article for women's info...primarily...

alpha
11-04-2010, 21:55
finished TV...Extra time...Male Hormone Restoration - 2 - Prostate Cancer, Low Testosterone, - Life Extension Health Concern (http://www.lef.org/protocols/male_reproductive/male_hormone_restoration_02.htm)

Low Free Testosterone, High Estradiol, Mid Total Testosterone
This situation suggests excessive aromatase activity, which converts free testosterone to estrogen. Inhibition of aromatase and reduction in aromatase-containing tissue (fat) is indicated. Suggestions include:


Take the following supplements:

Zinc (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptzinc)—50 milligrams (mg)/day
Acetyl-L-carnitine (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptalcarg)—1000 to 2000 mg/day
Muira puama (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptmiraforte)—850 mg/day
Chrysin (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptmiraforte)—1500 mg/day
Piperine (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptmiraforte)—10 mg/day to enhance absorption of chrysin
Quercetin (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptquercetin)—500 to 1000 mg/day


Lose weight to reduce aromatase activity.
Reduce or eliminate alcohol to enable the liver to better remove excess estrogen.
Review all current medications to see if they are interfering with healthy liver function. Common medications that affect liver function are nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs) such as naproxen, ibuprofen, acetaminophen, and aspirin; the statin class of cholesterol-lowering drugs; some heart medications; some blood pressure–lowering medications; and some antidepressants. Drugs being prescribed to treat the symptoms of testosterone deficiency (such as the statins and certain antidepressants) may actually aggravate the testosterone deficit, thus making the cholesterol problem or depression worse. However, do not discontinue any prescription medicine without consulting your physician.
If all of the above fail to increase free testosterone and lower excess estradiol, consider discussing with your physician the use of the aromatase inhibitor anastrozole at the very low dose of 0.5 mg twice per week.


General Nutrients to Boost Testosterone

A number of nutrients have been studied for their ability to boost testosterone and/or treat conditions such as erectile dysfunction and loss of libido. This nutrient group includes antioxidants, which may function by reducing oxidative damage to testosterone-producing tissues.


Selenium (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptselenium)—200 micrograms (mcg)/day
Vitamin A (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptvitamina)—5000 International Units (IU)/day
Vitamin E (http://www.lef.org/newshop/cgi-shop/searchItems.cgi?keyword=dptvitamine)—400 IU/day with at least 200 mg of gamma-tocopherol




-----Just info. off the internet....Read risks to benefits and make your own decisions....
Numerous warnings of taking high amounts are listed on page 2

Lulubelle
11-05-2010, 01:06
Buddha,

Ah, testosterone, my favorite hormone. Endocrinology was my area of practice.

Forgive me for piping in, I am a girl with perhaps too much testosterone (yes, us girls have it too, it modulates sex drive), but may I offer up some food for thought?

I heartily concur that you need to see an Endocrinologist. Although I favor natural approaches when possible and when doing so will not compromise a person's health, but not in your case. You and your wife are trying to have a little buddha. Trying to boost your levels naturally is certainly possible, but at best, it would take a long time and you might hope to get into the low normal range and have an improvement in symptoms. That may not be enough to help with fertility. Taking exogenous testerone will get you a bit higher in range more quickly and give you many more strong swimmers.

When the kid question is not longer important, you can certain approach it in a more natural way.

One downside is that it could change your personality a bit if there is a big shift in your levels. The burping, farting, aggressive, controlling, angry genes will be more active. Seriously. It should not be a big issue unless your levels are high in range, and it may not be an issue if you do not have strong tendencies towards such things to begin with. If you have a tendency for hair loss, testosterone will help you lose it. Women who have the same genetic tendency are protected due to estrogen.

I love testosterone. Good stuff.

buddha0724
11-05-2010, 06:55
First off I have to say. Holy Crap! Thank you for all for your replies and advice. I spent a good part of the night reviewing online articels and talking with the wife.

We both agree we need more professional help and I am going to ask my doc for a name of a endo. The confusing part of all of this is since we are trying ot have a little buddha and it has been over a year we thought to take the next step and see if there is a reason. SO along with the testosterone test we did the normal male fertility tests too. Focused on me because of a prior injury and surgery from my youth. But that part came back normal and all my little guys are swimming right and look right.

Just confusing. Thanks again for all of the advice and information. It is helpful and comforting to know I can ask such a question.

buddha0724
11-05-2010, 07:09
Lululbelle -

Thanks for that and dont apologizing for piping in. I posted for a reason and want to hear everybodys experiences and knowledge on the subject. You made a few good points that i have not read about or was mentioned to me about taking testosterone. I am losing my hair and will have a grandpa or Opa ring as we call it here really soon. As for my temperment? I am a very easy going, very positive person and dont think I could handle then change but it is good to know so I am ready for it.

Thanks again.

scubadiver888
11-05-2010, 07:17
First off I have to say. Holy Crap! Thank you for all for your replies and advice. I spent a good part of the night reviewing online articels and talking with the wife.

We both agree we need more professional help and I am going to ask my doc for a name of a endo. The confusing part of all of this is since we are trying ot have a little buddha and it has been over a year we thought to take the next step and see if there is a reason. SO along with the testosterone test we did the normal male fertility tests too. Focused on me because of a prior injury and surgery from my youth. But that part came back normal and all my little guys are swimming right and look right.

Just confusing. Thanks again for all of the advice and information. It is helpful and comforting to know I can ask such a question.

Just wanted to clarify something. I started with medical therapy and diet changes. Only once everything was looking good I switched to diet alone. Basically, I have found that diet and exercise helps to maintain but I really needed the steroid therapy to get my levels back to normal.

Also wanted to mention my sister. She tried and tried to have a baby. She just couldn't get anything to take. She got checked. Husband got checked. Everything was looking fine. After a few YEARS of trying she gave up. A few months later and she was pregnant. Doctor is guessing it was just stressing over trying to have a baby that made it difficult to have a baby.

The moral of the story... have fun trying and don't stress. ;)

TJDiver
11-05-2010, 07:45
Just wanted to clarify something. I started with medical therapy and diet changes. Only once everything was looking good I switched to diet alone. Basically, I have found that diet and exercise helps to maintain but I really needed the steroid therapy to get my levels back to normal.

Also wanted to mention my sister. She tried and tried to have a baby. She just couldn't get anything to take. She got checked. Husband got checked. Everything was looking fine. After a few YEARS of trying she gave up. A few months later and she was pregnant. Doctor is guessing it was just stressing over trying to have a baby that made it difficult to have a baby.

The moral of the story... have fun trying and don't stress. ;)

Yep, same thing with me and my wife. Have a few drinks, and have some fun...the bread will be rising before you know it. :smiley36:

Rileybri
11-05-2010, 07:52
buddah I hope things go good, I think you are doing the right thing, going with the less intrusive natrlal stuff...

and...

I hope everything comes out ok. :smiley20::smiley36:

ok that was just wrong! lol

buddha0724
11-05-2010, 08:36
ok that was just wrong! lol

It was but I was expecting it from ScubaStud!

Besides it was relatively tame and made me laugh.