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coralcrazed
09-24-2007, 13:51
I plan on buying some equipment... well most of my equipment. a reg,octo,guages,computer,bc the question is... I dive exclusively on vacation and will not get to use the new stuff until the summer when I go away... If I buy the equipment now and say I don't go away for more than one year later. do I still need to get the regs serviced? perhaps this is a question for larry and anyone else who feel qualified to answer this. Thanks:smiley2:

subsur
09-24-2007, 16:05
well, if you want to keep "lifetime warranty", then the answer is YES - you have to do the service. it's like a car and oil change.

quasimoto
09-24-2007, 21:36
You might find out that parts for life isn't that big of a deal especially if the regs are going to sit in the closet for, say two years. You pay $50 a year total of $100. Or you pay say $75 for just when you need it.
But yes you do need to service your regs especially if they are going to sit. This is worse on a reg than diving it.

in_cavediver
09-24-2007, 22:02
I plan on buying some equipment... well most of my equipment. a reg,octo,guages,computer,bc the question is... I dive exclusively on vacation and will not get to use the new stuff until the summer when I go away... If I buy the equipment now and say I don't go away for more than one year later. do I still need to get the regs serviced? perhaps this is a question for larry and anyone else who feel qualified to answer this. Thanks:smiley2:

Personally, I'd wait until a few months before your trip to buy, then go play in a pool and take the trip.

As for servicing regs. The politically correct answer is 1 year or what the manufacturer says. (Salvo and Dive Rite are 2 years, atomic might be as well not sure though).

I, on the other hand, have several first stages in the 3-5 year range. I service those when they need it. (I monitor IP's and do the service myself). On the 2nd stages, every couple years is about the most I'd want them to go. They are exposed to the elements and can get 'yucky' over time. This is also the piece you put in your mouth so put it in perspective there.

Now, if you want the extended service window, don't worry to much about the first stage other than keeping is dry and clean. Definitley inspect each year and before you use it for damaged hoses and for IP creep. For the 2nd stages, look online and see if your reg is one where you can release the pressure on the seat. If you can, it can be stored much longer with no loss of performance. If it can't releive pressure on the seat then that seat can take a 'set' which starts down the service me sooner cycle.

Whatver route you take - the idle or service. Make sure to test your gear a couple weeks in advance of your trip in a local pool. Most reg issues come right after servicing or from gross neglect. You want to know if you have an issue before leaving.

coralcrazed
09-25-2007, 00:00
so can i assume from what you are all telling me that when you buy a reg from a store and that reg has sat for more than one year on the shelf in the store, the stroe will service it prior to sending it out to you?

and what da'heck is an IP?

in_cavediver
09-25-2007, 05:21
so can i assume from what you are all telling me that when you buy a reg from a store and that reg has sat for more than one year on the shelf in the store, the stroe will service it prior to sending it out to you?

and what da'heck is an IP?

First, an IP is the intermediate pressure. Its the pressue the first stage steps tank pressure. The 2nd stage then brings it down to ambient. On most regs, the Intermediate pressure is around 120-150psi.

As for the second question about regs sitting around for a year or more on the shelf somewhere, I doubt a shop services them prior to sending it with the customer. I mean its new right....

coralcrazed
09-25-2007, 10:25
so tht brings me to my first quesion... If I get it new and wait more than a year to dive it. Do I need to service it? I'm confused.

quasimoto
09-25-2007, 14:50
so tht brings me to my first quesion... If I get it new and wait more than a year to dive it. Do I need to service it? I'm confused.

Yes, have it serviced. This is just a personal opinion. In_cavediver does bring up a good point about the reg sitting on the shelf at the LDS.

in_cavediver
09-25-2007, 18:24
so tht brings me to my first quesion... If I get it new and wait more than a year to dive it. Do I need to service it? I'm confused.

Yes, have it serviced. This is just a personal opinion. In_cavediver does bring up a good point about the reg sitting on the shelf at the LDS.

This is good advice. When in doubt, inspect and service your gear. (be sure to verify functionality though prior to any real diving). Anxiety over small things such as this contributes to stress during dives. A goal is to remove as much stress as possible when diving, both for enjoyment and safety.

quasimoto
09-25-2007, 20:02
so tht brings me to my first quesion... If I get it new and wait more than a year to dive it. Do I need to service it? I'm confused.

Yes, have it serviced. This is just a personal opinion. In_cavediver does bring up a good point about the reg sitting on the shelf at the LDS.

This is good advice. When in doubt, inspect and service your gear. (be sure to verify functionality though prior to any real diving). Anxiety over small things such as this contributes to stress during dives. A goal is to remove as much stress as possible when diving, both for enjoyment and safety.

Good point. Do a dive before your vacation just to check out your gear. Breathing off it at the surface doesn't mean that it will work at depth either.

keyshunter
09-26-2007, 06:23
so tht brings me to my first quesion... If I get it new and wait more than a year to dive it. Do I need to service it? I'm confused.

Most manufacturers' free parts agreements require a service (check or rebuild, depending upon the manufacturer) within a certain period (usually about 30 days) of the anniversary date. That is purchase date, not in-service date. So, even if you do not use the reg, the time limit applies. An lds can "fudge" these dates a bit, if within reason. If you do not care about the free parts option, service it when you want.

It is sometimes argued that lack of use is as bad for a reg as heavy use, but in my experience this has not been the case. I have had backup regs that were stored on the boat for several years after initial testing (a few dives, and then careful rinsing), that have functioned perfectly when used. But that is, of course, extrapolation from a rather small sample.

Iceman
09-26-2007, 11:21
Just a question: If you only dive once a year on vacation, why are you buying regulators?

It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. After all they have business and liability incentives to keep their gear, if not pretty, very functional. Any sanitation issue could be taken care of by a careful cleaning of your rental's second stage and replacing the mouthpiece.

Buoyant1
09-26-2007, 11:23
I've been doing it every year, but I've heard different stories from different people..some go by the one year 50 dives, some go by the one year 100 dives...

Not messing with MY life...I go every year!

in_cavediver
09-26-2007, 18:20
I've been doing it every year, but I've heard different stories from different people..some go by the one year 50 dives, some go by the one year 100 dives...

Not messing with MY life...I go every year!

Not to throw a kink in this but most reg failures occur right AFTER service so frequent service may be more risky....(ducking now)

Honestly, each diver needs to look at this for themselves. Vance Harlow (www.airspeedpress.com) has a great book on regulators. It has design information, service information and theory of operation. A really good read for any savvy and interested diver. (They also have great stickers too)
http://www.airspeedpress.com/StickersAll.jpg

coralcrazed
09-27-2007, 09:07
I've been doing it every year, but I've heard different stories from different people..some go by the one year 50 dives, some go by the one year 100 dives...

Not messing with MY life...I go every year!

Honestly, each diver needs to look at this for themselves. Vance Harlow (www.airspeedpress.com (http://www.airspeedpress.com)) has a great book on regulators. It has design information, service information and theory of operation. A really good read for any savvy and interested diver. (They also have great stickers too)


so in theory can you do your own service on your own regulator? Does anyone other than athorized deales do this servie for themselves?

coralcrazed
09-27-2007, 09:19
Just a question: If you only dive once a year on vacation, why are you buying regulators?

It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. After all they have business and liability incentives to keep their gear, if not pretty, very functional. Any sanitation issue could be taken care of by a careful cleaning of your rental's second stage and replacing the mouthpiece.

Thats a very good question... It has been somwhat agonizing to consider the purchase of all of my gear. I am only a vacation diver but I know I'll be doig it forever. too am unsure if the cost outweighs the need for my own gear. Here's the think, I recently got back from a jamaica trip where I could have gone diving 2 tanks per day. day trips were deep ives and afternoon dives were shallower 60 ft max. So, I go on my first div at the resort and I don't like what I see at all. reg hoses cracked and split... second stages beat up to a pulp. DM's very layedback... spg even conked out on me during my dive. This was such a concern to me on this trip that I forfitted most of my dives (divs were included inthe package)... Wife was upset as she knows how I love to dive (sh dos not dive) and didn't reallyunderstand why I wasn't diving. his trip reall woke me up to the dangers of diving beatup equip. needless to say I only dove three times out of a possible 14 dives. Horrible... as I now dream of diving everyday.

so this question of maintenance is a real one to me. I'm not sure what to think. I hav had years where I don't get a hance to go away and others where I don' go to a div spot destination. so what to do? do I buy my own equipment? is it actually going to be safer if there are years thatI skip service? I do plan to servicebefor I go diving but I don't knw if I will do it if I don' dive... I don't kno if anyone can offer adifinitive answer to this but...

in_cavediver
09-27-2007, 11:33
I've been doing it every year, but I've heard different stories from different people..some go by the one year 50 dives, some go by the one year 100 dives...

Not messing with MY life...I go every year!

Honestly, each diver needs to look at this for themselves. Vance Harlow (www.airspeedpress.com (http://www.airspeedpress.com)) has a great book on regulators. It has design information, service information and theory of operation. A really good read for any savvy and interested diver. (They also have great stickers too)


so in theory can you do your own service on your own regulator? Does anyone other than athorized deales do this servie for themselves?

I do. I service all 8 of my regs and I am not an authorized dealer. They include (3) Dive Rite RG2500's, (2) Zeagle Envoys, (1) Zeagle Flathead 6, (1) Zeagle DS4 and (1) Sherwood Blizzard.

Parts are available if you know who to talk to. (hint: I just got the last batch from ST)

coralcrazed
09-27-2007, 13:38
ok so the book is $50 and the parts are what they are... How much for the tools necessary to do it all yourself? Did someone train you how to do it or did you just read it in the books? How difficult is it? I design and build buildings so I have many tools like a circular saw to get in and slice the thing up ;)

jo8243
09-27-2007, 13:55
The internal o-rings and other parts still go bad sitting in a closet. So yes, service it before you dive if it has been >1yr since last service. And any new stuff should have been serviced when you bought it by the LDS unless you bought it from some schmucks like leisurepro.

jo8243
09-27-2007, 13:57
Just a question: If you only dive once a year on vacation, why are you buying regulators?

It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. After all they have business and liability incentives to keep their gear, if not pretty, very functional. Any sanitation issue could be taken care of by a careful cleaning of your rental's second stage and replacing the mouthpiece.

lol @ this post.
:smilie39:

ccarter
09-27-2007, 13:59
The internal o-rings and other parts still go bad sitting in a closet. So yes, service it before you dive if it has been >1yr since last service. And any new stuff should have been serviced when you bought it by the LDS unless you bought it from some schmucks like leisurepro.
I bought my first reg from leisure pro (I was young/stupid) and when I got it serviced at the LDS they were like "yeaah.. this has some really old parts in it"

ccarter
09-27-2007, 14:04
Just a question: If you only dive once a year on vacation, why are you buying regulators?

It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. After all they have business and liability incentives to keep their gear, if not pretty, very functional. Any sanitation issue could be taken care of by a careful cleaning of your rental's second stage and replacing the mouthpiece.
Wow.. Don't think I'd be willing to put my life in the hands of some of the dive operations I've seen while traveling.. Every single tank I got when I was in Bonaire had a bad o-ring just about and was generally in crappy looking condition. Even locally some of the rental tanks I've used were ~3 years out of VIP..

I don't think some countries are aware of liability incentives being that they're not full of sue happy Americanos. It's da island mon! No worries mon!

jo8243
09-27-2007, 15:25
(I was young/stupid)

You say that like it's past tense.
:cwmddd:

ccarter
09-27-2007, 15:33
(I was young/stupid)

You say that like it's past tense.
:cwmddd:
Beats old/bald! :smiley36:

coralcrazed
09-27-2007, 15:45
ok... this thread has gone in the toilet I see!

georoc01
09-27-2007, 16:34
I think the answer is yes, get your reg serviced. Can you do it yourself? Sure. But make sure you have the guages to be able to be able to monitor and adjust the ISG.

Personally, after watching my tech do it last night and assisting him with the bench they have, I would rather pay the money to have them do it. Of course, their service also includes a pool dive so you can test the equipment yourself afterwards as well. Something I don't have at home.

Also some regs are much more complex than others. Comparing the parts in say my Octo to an Atomic reg, the number of parts in the kits are about 20X more.

Iceman
09-27-2007, 18:49
Just a question: If you only dive once a year on vacation, why are you buying regulators?

It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. After all they have business and liability incentives to keep their gear, if not pretty, very functional. Any sanitation issue could be taken care of by a careful cleaning of your rental's second stage and replacing the mouthpiece.

Thats a very good question... It has been somwhat agonizing to consider the purchase of all of my gear. I am only a vacation diver but I know I'll be doig it forever. too am unsure if the cost outweighs the need for my own gear. Here's the think, I recently got back from a jamaica trip where I could have gone diving 2 tanks per day. day trips were deep ives and afternoon dives were shallower 60 ft max. So, I go on my first div at the resort and I don't like what I see at all. reg hoses cracked and split... second stages beat up to a pulp. DM's very layedback... spg even conked out on me during my dive. This was such a concern to me on this trip that I forfitted most of my dives (divs were included inthe package)... Wife was upset as she knows how I love to dive (sh dos not dive) and didn't reallyunderstand why I wasn't diving. his trip reall woke me up to the dangers of diving beatup equip. needless to say I only dove three times out of a possible 14 dives. Horrible... as I now dream of diving everyday.

so this question of maintenance is a real one to me. I'm not sure what to think. I hav had years where I don't get a hance to go away and others where I don' go to a div spot destination. so what to do? do I buy my own equipment? is it actually going to be safer if there are years thatI skip service? I do plan to servicebefor I go diving but I don't knw if I will do it if I don' dive... I don't kno if anyone can offer adifinitive answer to this but...

Well, I can only give you my take on it, but I didn't buy until I was sure I was going to do a fair amount of diving. Reliability and cost were my main two criteria in that decision.

I'm sure there are some places in the world where a person would be well advised to bring their own. But, most places the Once A Year diver will go are very tourist oriented. So, a person can be sure their gear, if not pretty, is safe. You can get a pretty good idea on the initial visual. I probably wouldn't have accepted ones that looked like you describe.

Plus, if a regulator is breathed through right after connecting to a cylinder, breathed through again as soon as it gets wet and passes the bubble check with no problems the odds are astronomically in favor of no problems during the dive.

Due to a regulator problem with one of mine, I had to rent on my last trip. Some were pretty well used and others weren't. I picked one that looked good on the visual.

So, I think renting is cheaper and probably is safer than owning for the "once a year" diver who goes to the usual tourist destinations.

BUT, if you want to spend the extra money for the gear, the annual maintenance and the pre-trip test dive to get comfort and more enjoyment of your trip I'll not argue. Comfort of the mind is worth a lot and is well worth it most of the time.

in_cavediver
09-27-2007, 19:06
ok so the book is $50 and the parts are what they are... How much for the tools necessary to do it all yourself? Did someone train you how to do it or did you just read it in the books? How difficult is it? I design and build buildings so I have many tools like a circular saw to get in and slice the thing up ;)

First, to answer the tools bit. Yes, there are specialized tools required and you can get most from peter built scubatools or global. Be prepared to pay though. A fairly complete set is a couple rebuilds in cost.

Now, for the training. I am an engineer and run the electronics shop in the Mechanical Engineering dept at Purdue. I tend to take apart 'delicate' and 'precision' items at work so a reg is not a big obstacle for me. Your mechanical experience and qualifications may be different and only you can truly gauge that.

With my experience, when I started I used the service manuals with a former tech on standby for problems. Aside from a bad o-ring in my first rebuild - no problems.

Will you, with a single reg save money by doing it yourself? Maybe over 5 years. The reason for you to do it is so you know you did it and did it right. It gives you the ability to troubleshoot it/fix it in the field on a trip. Its kinda the DIY mentality. Now, if you have 8 regs, you will save money. Simple math - figure 8 regs @ $60/yr thats $480.

Do I think everyone should service they own gear - Very much NO. Do I think that they could do it if they desired to - YES. Regs really aren't that complicated. All it takes is a little patience and the desire to do it and the right tools.

Iceman
09-27-2007, 19:17
As IN says; definitely a combination of the DIY mentality and economics. In the SCBA world the tech has to be certified, which I was, but in the SCUBA world I don't think there are any government regulations requiring certification.

But, like a lot of "simple" tasks there is a knack to regulator service. If a person does it with some regularity it is no big deal. But, once a year? I don't think the skill level would ever come up to par.

keyshunter
09-28-2007, 07:24
Just a question: If you only dive once a year on vacation, why are you buying regulators?

It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. After all they have business and liability incentives to keep their gear, if not pretty, very functional. Any sanitation issue could be taken care of by a careful cleaning of your rental's second stage and replacing the mouthpiece.

Thats a very good question... It has been somwhat agonizing to consider the purchase of all of my gear. I am only a vacation diver but I know I'll be doig it forever. too am unsure if the cost outweighs the need for my own gear. Here's the think, I recently got back from a jamaica trip where I could have gone diving 2 tanks per day. day trips were deep ives and afternoon dives were shallower 60 ft max. So, I go on my first div at the resort and I don't like what I see at all. reg hoses cracked and split... second stages beat up to a pulp. DM's very layedback... spg even conked out on me during my dive. This was such a concern to me on this trip that I forfitted most of my dives (divs were included inthe package)... Wife was upset as she knows how I love to dive (sh dos not dive) and didn't reallyunderstand why I wasn't diving. his trip reall woke me up to the dangers of diving beatup equip. needless to say I only dove three times out of a possible 14 dives. Horrible... as I now dream of diving everyday.

so this question of maintenance is a real one to me. I'm not sure what to think. I hav had years where I don't get a hance to go away and others where I don' go to a div spot destination. so what to do? do I buy my own equipment? is it actually going to be safer if there are years thatI skip service? I do plan to servicebefor I go diving but I don't knw if I will do it if I don' dive... I don't kno if anyone can offer adifinitive answer to this but...

CC,
I average about 6 Caribbean trips a year, some for 2 weeks each. Consequently, I see a lot of rental gear. Some shops do a fair job of maintenance, and some are terrible. The fact that there are many, many trouble free dives made on rental gear is more a testimony to the ruggedness and simplicity of the gear (Sherwood Bruts, Scubapro Mk 2's, etc.) than the quality of maintenance. That said, I ALWAYS travel with 2 regs and a service kit for at least 1 of them. Plan "C" is to borrow the tools I don't carry, if necessary, and rebuild one of the regs. Thus far, although I have used my backup reg a few times, I have never gotten to plan c.
I sometimes see privately owned regs give minor problems. These usually require a simple adjustment, which may or may not be made by the local shop tech. Usually, I hear "but I just had it rebuilt before I left". Rather like auto mechanics, there are many good, competent, caring reg techs, and at least as many about whom the opposite is true.

If I were in the circumstance you describe, I would buy a relatively simple reg, and have a local shop check (not rebuild unless necessary) it before a trip. I would not worry about the manufacturer's free parts warranty, since chances are that I could go several years without having it rebuilt. I would seriously consider a Sherwood, since even if I had to pay for parts, the kit (both stages) costs about $8.

In the long run, you will pay less than rentals, and you will gain the knowledge that your reg is in very good condition.

keyshunter
09-28-2007, 07:41
The internal o-rings and other parts still go bad sitting in a closet. So yes, service it before you dive if it has been >1yr since last service. And any new stuff should have been serviced when you bought it by the LDS unless you bought it from some schmucks like leisurepro.
I bought my first reg from leisure pro (I was young/stupid) and when I got it serviced at the LDS they were like "yeaah.. this has some really old parts in it"

Your implying that Leisurepro (or any other dealer) would substitute old parts into a new reg is laughable. Even if so inclined, the labor involved would far exceed any gain.

Also, regardless of personal feelings about Leisurepro, anyone with retail experience admits that they are excellent business people. As such, they do not sit on old inventory. They reduce price and close it out.

ccarter
09-28-2007, 07:51
The internal o-rings and other parts still go bad sitting in a closet. So yes, service it before you dive if it has been >1yr since last service. And any new stuff should have been serviced when you bought it by the LDS unless you bought it from some schmucks like leisurepro.
I bought my first reg from leisure pro (I was young/stupid) and when I got it serviced at the LDS they were like "yeaah.. this has some really old parts in it"

Your implying that Leisurepro (or any other dealer) would substitute old parts into a new reg is laughable. Even if so inclined, the labor involved would far exceed any gain.

Also, regardless of personal feelings about Leisurepro, anyone with retail experience admits that they are excellent business people. As such, they do not sit on old inventory. They reduce price and close it out.
Yeah.. I didn't say that they replaced all the parts with old parts.. not sure where you jumped to that conclusion from? I was however implying that it had probably been sitting for a while.. Yes they can price items to sell.. not much they can do other than that--sometimes it might take a while to get it off the shelf.

coralcrazed
09-28-2007, 22:46
The internal o-rings and other parts still go bad sitting in a closet. So yes, service it before you dive if it has been >1yr since last service. And any new stuff should have been serviced when you bought it by the LDS unless you bought it from some schmucks like leisurepro.
I bought my first reg from leisure pro (I was young/stupid) and when I got it serviced at the LDS they were like "yeaah.. this has some really old parts in it"

I think this is what they call "classic" hog wash. I don't belive that any huge outfit (and they are considered a gorilla) would do such a thing. What's the gain or bebefit to this? NONE! I also don't think (and I'm no expert in this) that they could possibly sell you a regulator that old that the parts are old enough to be identified as old parts. that would have to mean that the model is a 10 plus year old or something. I highly doubt that anything stays on thier shelves that long.

I think this is the case of the local tech trying to fill the head of a diver that "hey look what I've done for you, come back to me and you will be sure that I will replace all of your regulator parts ect"... it seemed to have worked in this case :smilie39:

coralcrazed
09-29-2007, 11:17
[quote=coralcrazed;62395][quote=Iceman;61806]
So, I think renting is cheaper and probably is safer than owning for the "once a year" diver who goes to the usual tourist destinations.

BUT, if you want to spend the extra money for the gear, the annual maintenance and the pre-trip test dive to get comfort and more enjoyment of your trip I'll not argue. Comfort of the mind is worth a lot and is well worth it most of the time.

is this just one persons view??? in terms of safety? sure I'll spend the money on new gear but only if it actually makes me a safer diver. this is the reason I started thinking about getting my own.

I wonder if getting in the tub will qualify as a diving the unit and make it safer...:smilie39: but seriously, someone said dive it in a pool and that should do it so why not a tub? LOL!

Iceman
09-29-2007, 13:05
Since you quoted me let me respond.

One of the problems with almost any kind of equpment that is used infrequently is deterioration over time. Call it Shelf Life if you will. To counter that almost any piece of gear that is used on a once a year basis needs to have a complete check before use.

Then, since it is accepted that immediate post-service dives are where service mistakes are caught you would need to do a local, controlled conditions dive before heading off on your trip. Of course, if you are only diving once a year that may be a good thing from a skills perspective. But, for this discussion, we are only talking about the equipment.

So, by the time you get done with it, there is considerable money involved. Whereas, when doing that once a year dive you are letting someone else make the expense and with proper inspection you can assure yourself the gear is safe. Check out rental rates at some of the dive operations. They are so cheap that you could rent for years and still be money ahead.

Frankly, I don't think most people even think in these terms. It is more common to make buy/rent decisions on emotional issues and the influence of local retailers.

coralcrazed
09-29-2007, 15:04
Since you quoted me let me respond.

One of the problems with almost any kind of equpment that is used infrequently is deterioration over time. Call it Shelf Life if you will. To counter that almost any piece of gear that is used on a once a year basis needs to have a complete check before use.

Then, since it is accepted that immediate post-service dives are where service mistakes are caught you would need to do a local, controlled conditions dive before heading off on your trip. Of course, if you are only diving once a year that may be a good thing from a skills perspective. But, for this discussion, we are only talking about the equipment.

So, by the time you get done with it, there is considerable money involved. Whereas, when doing that once a year dive you are letting someone else make the expense and with proper inspection you can assure yourself the gear is safe. Check out rental rates at some of the dive operations. They are so cheap that you could rent for years and still be money ahead.

Frankly, I don't think most people even think in these terms. It is more common to make buy/rent decisions on emotional issues and the influence of local retailers.

what you say is all fine and good... however, again I am refering srictly to safety. you mantioned that it is more safe to rent gear than own it if you use it infrequently. This is what I question what others think of this issue? thank you though for clarifying the issue even deeper.

let me put it this way... lets say that you own a reg. that has sat on a shelf for 11 months so you check it in a pool. everything seems cool. Is the reg safer than a reg that has been used consecutively for 11 months. thats what I want to know. perhaps its a question for the manufacturer of the reg?

coralcrazed
09-29-2007, 15:09
Frankly, I don't think most people even think in these terms. It is more common to make buy/rent decisions on emotional issues and the influence of local retailers.

well than there's people like me... :smilie39: its niether emotion or influence but concern for safety.

Iceman
09-29-2007, 15:10
Actually, what I said was:

"It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. "

coralcrazed
09-29-2007, 16:40
Actually, what I said was:

"It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. "

yah but you also said and I quote...
Originally Posted by Iceman http://forum.scubatoys.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://forum.scubatoys.com/showthread.php?p=61806#post61806)
"So, I think renting is cheaper and probably is safer than owning for the "once a year" diver who goes to the usual tourist destinations."

If you intended it in another way without question as to safety... please let me know as this is causing some concern for me. again I would like to buy my own equipment so that it will make me a safer diver and hope that I don't inadvertantly do the oposite...

Iceman
09-29-2007, 21:32
Actually, what I said was:

"It seems to me the service and reliability issue would be taken care of by renting; and it probably would be cheaper. "

yah but you also said and I quote...
Originally Posted by Iceman http://forum.scubatoys.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://forum.scubatoys.com/showthread.php?p=61806#post61806)
"So, I think renting is cheaper and probably is safer than owning for the "once a year" diver who goes to the usual tourist destinations."

If you intended it in another way without question as to safety... please let me know as this is causing some concern for me. again I would like to buy my own equipment so that it will make me a safer diver and hope that I don't inadvertantly do the oposite...

Coral; I believe you are overthinking this and being a hair too concerned about "safety". Let me rephrase so that it is clearer for your decision making.
-Life is risky. Nothing is truly "safe". The only real question is how we are going to spend the days/hours/minutes we have while not knowing exactly how many we have.
-If you are the type of diver who uses the regulators once a year, puts them on the shelf until next year and then uses them again without doing any maintenance renting will probably give you a more reliable regulator.
-However, if you are the type of person who, after a year on the shelf, takes the regulators to a shop to have them examined and overhauled if necessary and then does a test dive or two before going on the trip they will probably be just as reliable as rental.
-So that leaves economics as the decider. Many places I'm familiar with have very low rental rates for those who buy multi-day packages. One place I know will even loan you a set of regulators and console if you buy a 5 day package. That is much cheaper than owning and maintaining.
-But, for some people, owning provides a warm, fuzzy feeling that is worth the extra cost and trouble to own.

coralcrazed
09-29-2007, 23:27
ok... anyone else wish comment on weather renting is safer than owning?

in_cavediver
09-30-2007, 09:22
ok... anyone else wish comment on weather renting is safer than owning?

Purely opinion but owning is safer than renting for a single reason. If you own it, you know its history, its service history and its normal operating characteristics. If you rent, you are relying on a third party to ensure the equipment is functional and giving up the knowledge of history, service and normal operating characteristics.

The real question: Is there a measurable/significant difference in safety from a rental regulator and a personally owned regulator?

On that I say probably not. The difference in safety comes from a diver who owns their gear diving more since they have it. That experience will have an impact on safety and is reflected in the DAN incident statistics.

ccarter
09-30-2007, 14:58
The internal o-rings and other parts still go bad sitting in a closet. So yes, service it before you dive if it has been >1yr since last service. And any new stuff should have been serviced when you bought it by the LDS unless you bought it from some schmucks like leisurepro.
I bought my first reg from leisure pro (I was young/stupid) and when I got it serviced at the LDS they were like "yeaah.. this has some really old parts in it"

I think this is what they call "classic" hog wash. I don't belive that any huge outfit (and they are considered a gorilla) would do such a thing. What's the gain or bebefit to this? NONE! I also don't think (and I'm no expert in this) that they could possibly sell you a regulator that old that the parts are old enough to be identified as old parts. that would have to mean that the model is a 10 plus year old or something. I highly doubt that anything stays on thier shelves that long.

I think this is the case of the local tech trying to fill the head of a diver that "hey look what I've done for you, come back to me and you will be sure that I will replace all of your regulator parts ect"... it seemed to have worked in this case :smilie39:
Actually I didn't go back to that LBS.. started shopping on this site. Guess it didn't work. :smiley13:

ccarter
09-30-2007, 14:59
ok... anyone else wish comment on weather renting is safer than owning?

Purely opinion but owning is safer than renting for a single reason. If you own it, you know its history, its service history and its normal operating characteristics. If you rent, you are relying on a third party to ensure the equipment is functional and giving up the knowledge of history, service and normal operating characteristics.

The real question: Is there a measurable/significant difference in safety from a rental regulator and a personally owned regulator?

On that I say probably not. The difference in safety comes from a diver who owns their gear diving more since they have it. That experience will have an impact on safety and is reflected in the DAN incident statistics.
Well said. Agreed 100%.

coralcrazed
09-30-2007, 18:07
ok... anyone else wish comment on weather renting is safer than owning?

Purely opinion but owning is safer than renting for a single reason. If you own it, you know its history, its service history and its normal operating characteristics. If you rent, you are relying on a third party to ensure the equipment is functional and giving up the knowledge of history, service and normal operating characteristics.

The real question: Is there a measurable/significant difference in safety from a rental regulator and a personally owned regulator?

On that I say probably not. The difference in safety comes from a diver who owns their gear diving more since they have it. That experience will have an impact on safety and is reflected in the DAN incident statistics.
Well said and its easier to agree with this statement as it makes better sence... I just hope that having equipment will make dive more. I'll probably hit the pool more with it till my trips. thank you for responding.

CrzyJay456
09-30-2007, 19:21
ok... anyone else wish comment on weather renting is safer than owning?

both are safe, as long as its all well maintained!
if you own a reg, and never care for it, then renting is safer. if you rent from a place that has horrible upkeep, then its safer to own.

coralcrazed
09-30-2007, 21:53
welp, I think it all boils down to how well you care for your equipment and making a commitment to keeping the regs in good shape...

ok here is the round up ofdo's and don't and if anyone would like to add to it by all means:

1. keep your regulator serviced according to manf. specs.
2. dive your regulator as often as possible... if not possible pool dive it to keep internal parts moving.
3. keep your regs out of direct sunlight.
4. keep regs out of hot car trunks
5. rinse your regulator according to manf. specs
6. keep it stored in a cool dry area inside of specialy designed bags tokeep the critters out.

Did I leave anything out?