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dmdoss
07-24-2007, 22:27
IMO, it seems diver's really turn out for shows or events. So why don't more LDS and gear companies hold events? Or sponsor dive teams that travel around showing their gear? Maybe Larry or Joe can chime in on this one.

techgnostic
07-24-2007, 23:06
IMO, it seems diver's really turn out for shows or events. So why don't more LDS and gear companies hold events? Or sponsor dive teams that travel around showing their gear? Maybe Larry or Joe can chime in on this one.
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>Especially divers. Face it, we are mostly gear heads. Trade shows are a blast for that sort of thing. And it's not like divers are proven travelers. Host is on a cruise ship, with dive stops, as part of a 4-day event in the gulf...and embark out of New Orleans too!</DIV>

Moxie
07-24-2007, 23:08
I believe there are a few of these. Whites had their dive team. But I'd certainly paint ScubaToys over every available part of me if that meant discounts!

ScubaToys Larry
07-24-2007, 23:35
I believe there are a few of these. Whites had their dive team. But I'd certainly paint ScubaToys over every available part of me if that meant discounts!
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>I talked to Joe... He said to get the discount, he gets to do the painting!</DIV>

Moxie
07-24-2007, 23:44
I believe there are a few of these. Whites had their dive team. But I'd certainly paint ScubaToys over every available part of me if that meant discounts!
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>I talked to Joe... He said to get the discount, he gets to do the painting!</DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>That would so have to go the webcam!</DIV>

Black-Gorrilla
07-25-2007, 06:03
IMO, it seems diver's really turn out for shows or events. So why don't more LDS and gear companies hold events? Or sponsor dive teams that travel around showing their gear? Maybe Larry or Joe can chime in on this one.
<div></div>
<div>Especially divers. Face it, we are mostly gear heads. Trade shows are a blast for that sort of thing. And it's not like divers are proven travelers. Host is on a cruise ship, with dive stops, as part of a 4-day event in the gulf...and embark out of New Orleans too!</div>


im in on that...

ScubaToys Larry
07-25-2007, 10:14
It's a weird and unfortunate set of circumstances that overall, or at least in our area, dive shops have a tendency of hating each other. As far as an event, let me outline the details of the last one we had.

We built a new pavilion out at Clear Springs Scuba Park (for those of you who are not in the Dallas Area, it is the local rock quarry where most the shops go to do our training). We planned on holding an event out there this spring to show off the new facility, and invite everyone to come do some dives. We got manufacturers to donate a lot of give-aways (over $17,000 worth of goodies) and donate sample gear to let people try out... fins, BC's camera's, you name it. We had booked a band, arranged food, drink, games, etc.

Unfortunately, this spring, Texas had record rain fall, and with all the rain, the dock and platform could not get set in time, and we were scheduled for another huge rainstorm the day we had scheduled the event. So we had to move it back a month. We checked the calendar of CSSP and any local dive shops to make sure we were not conflicting with any dates, then rebooked the band, food, etc. and posted the info on our site.

Three days later, we get a call from CSSP that the other dive shops in town were planning on having a Dive Rite test dive day that day, so they did not want us out with our event on that day.

We talked to the other stores and explained that this would be perfect, as they were going to have tents set up on one side of the park, we would have ours on the other side, we'd draw a bunch of people with 2 events going on and the customers could wander between the 2 parties and have a great reason to come out.

The other dive shops held an "emergency meeting" and basically said we could not come out that day, and if we were allowed to hold our event out there, they would find a new place to do their training.

Unable to reschedule to another day due to conflicts with the band schedule, the food, etc, we just moved the venue to our shop for the day. We had over 1000 people show up for the day, and had a great time. Here's some info about the event we held http://www.scubatoys.com/LakegrandOpen.asp.

I wish shops could get along and work together on promotions, events, etc, but it seems like everyone is so worried about a diver taking a class at another shop, that none of them want to associate with each other.

Years ago, an independent trade show company ran a local dive show in Dallas, and when I was making the Scuba Tool, I hit several local shows through out the country, Houston, east coast, Long Beach, etc... but for whatever reason - it seems like people are not as interested in attending these events anymore and they are not profitable enough to hold anymore.

ertechsg
07-25-2007, 10:55
The ST party was the BOMB !Even got a 2for 1 on AOWand rescue. Thanks ST.Ready for next year.

3rdEye
07-26-2007, 12:53
The other dive shops held an "emergency meeting" and basically said we could not come out that day, and if we were allowed to hold our event out there, they would find a new place to do their training.


I wish shops could get along and work together on promotions, events, etc, but it seems like everyone is so worried about a diver taking a class at another shop, that none of them want to associate with each other.



<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>that's unfortunate.....seems like a lot of dive shops have it in for you.....a local shop I was pricing some equipment at was kind of hostile about the prices you offered as well......i think maybe they should be studying your business model and learning something.....I don't really see how the hostility helps their business.</DIV>

Vercingetorix
07-29-2007, 08:15
Larry,

WOW...just wow... An incredible story. Thanks for sharing. I, too, planned to attend at CSSP, but was thrilled when it was moved to the shop (for very selfish reasons...ST is only 15 minutes from my house). I was looking forward to seeing the new pavillion, dock, and platform (I was coming with gear). I had heard rumors of the relationship between ST and CSSP; thanks for providing facts. (Meanwhile, at the shop party, I registered for Scuba Diver Rescue, bought a wetsuit at a great price, and bought a few other goodies. The wife still doesn't know I own the wetsuit; she thinks Joe is renting it to me for an extended period.)

I'm sorry that you and Joe had to go through that experience with CSSP. Especially as it concerns the other LDS's. I've seen some stats about profit margins in the LDS business, and Joe was quite open and honest when he an I talked last December. I understand the margins to be low and that is why LDS's are dropping out (latest D/FW demise, Surface Interval of Arlington).

In a perfect world, the industry would band together to support one another. While I understand the competitive business model and Survival of the Fit, it would benefit all if each got a piece of the pie, instead of trying to grab the whole thing.

I like doing business with ST, partially because you aren't trying to grab the whole thing. Your prices are fair; you don't use predatory pricing; you don't use mass quantity to make-up in volume what you lose in profit on a single item.
Your people are very helpful (give Will a raise; the lad deserves it. In fact, give him two). You offer full waranties.

If this is the business of Survival, then others should look at it and learn. With a cohesive view among LDS', you all could come together to share the pie. And that would benefit all, divers and shop owners.

In a perfect world...

ReefHound
07-29-2007, 09:22
I don't think the issue was so much with CSSP as with the other dive shops. They issued an ultimatum and unfairly forced Robert to choose between one or the other. In a perfect world, the one making such a demand would be told to go jump in (another) lake, but sometimes the economic consequences of doing that cannot be dismissed.

Just another example of the class act that ScubaToys is, I've not seen them name those shops by name and call for any vendetta, I'm not sure if I could have done the same.

ScubaToys Larry
07-29-2007, 09:58
Just for the record, I have no problem with CSSP or Robert - He was just doing what he thought would be best for his business. Actually I feel the same way about the other shops. Even though I believe they were wrong thinking that our event out there would be detrimental to their event out there, it was a decision they made to try to improve their business. I never have a problem with someone trying to succeed. Heck I do!

So I have no hard feelings toward anyone concerning the event. Ours was a great success for us, although I could not attend as I was in Australia - but I spied on the cam and got reports and pictures...

Hopefully everyone had a great weekend, and who knows, maybe in the future shops will try to work together, and maybe they will try to include instead of exclude us.

WaterRat
07-29-2007, 10:17
Hummm, anyone know if they had 1000 people at the Dive Rite show? Somehow I doubt it since everyone was at Scubatoys. :smiley15:

Ron

cummings66
07-29-2007, 11:23
I'd be willing to bet they hurt their numbers in the end by doing what they chose to do. Live and learn, except it seems dive shops don't learn the lessons.

It's the same in other businesses as well, I work at a store that sells electronics and I see this type of behavior all the time. It's human nature.

Vercingetorix
07-29-2007, 11:29
I'd be willing to bet they hurt their numbers Had ScubaToys been at CSSP, that would have been a major drawing card. I live an hour from CSSP and I would have driven the distance for both ST and the other LDSs and CSSP would have received another $20 admission. As it was, only ST got my business that day. Imagine if the 1000+ folks that went to the shop went to CSSP instead. That's $20,000 that CSSP would have raked in and the other LDS's would have increased their exposure.

ScubaToys: 1
Other LDSs: 0

ReefHound
07-29-2007, 15:49
Hummm, anyone know if they had 1000 people at the Dive Rite show? Somehow I doubt it since everyone was at Scubatoys. :smiley15:

Ron

Not even close, in fact Saturday was really pretty slow in my opinion. It was my third time there and the least crowded ever.

WaterRat
07-29-2007, 22:03
[/quote]

Not even close, in fact Saturday was really pretty slow in my opinion. It was my third time there and the least crowded ever.[/QUOTE]

I figured as much.

dmdoss
07-29-2007, 22:33
Well if other LDS want to be player's in the market, maybe they should model themselves after ST. The market place is going to decide if a LDS is going to survive or die. And "us diver's" the market has decided that we want more shops like ST. So the one's that diss the other shop's, degrade them, or make it out like there doing a bad thing, may go under. How many times have you been in a shop and they just run down another? a few for me. I just dont like it. And some shop's do have nice guy's, want to help the customer, and just don't make it. There's only one shop in my town that I will goto for anything. He real helpfull, answer my questions, and doesnt run shops down. And that's why I go there. Besides the fact it to long of a drive to goto ST for air refill's. One would think there would be more shop's that would want a event with multible shop's there, if they think they provide a superior service or product.

WaterRat
07-30-2007, 09:27
Well if other LDS want to be player's in the market, maybe they should model themselves after ST.

I actually had conversations around this with a couple of local shops that were closer to me. Specifically about adding an on-line sales feature and start small buy buying an item in bulk. They could offer that item at a great price for the on-line and in store customer and build from there. All they wanted to do was tell me how evil on-line sales are. Then when I roll into the shop I don't get half the service I get from ST. As long as these guys don't want to listen to the customer, Larry has minimal competition.

Ron