undergarments

[skdvr]

Originally Posted by bubbletrubble

With so many possible drysuit + undergarment combinations, I think the more datapoints you have the better. I test-dove a Whites Fusion drysuit with Whites undergarments -- MK2 john (including sleeves) + MK2 jacket (with sleeves off) -- in local San Diego waters (low 50 degrees F at depth). With that shell suit, the MK2 "system" was simply not warm enough for me. I was quite cold after a 50 minute dive. I am much more comfortable temperature-wise using my Bare Nex-Gen Pro + Bare T100 Thinsulate underwear. I will admit that I'm somewhat of a cold water wuss, but I tend to hover in one place a lot while taking UW pics.

That is why I was saying at the end of my first post that everyone is different. For me with the Fusion and just the MK2 (no jacket) I am completely comfortable in 50* water for dives as long as an hour. Now this is in a quarry with not much to take pics of so I am not hovering in one place for a long time. That can make a big difference as you point out. Most of my dives are on the move for a large portion of the dive. I am 5'11" and weigh 200lbs, and like I said I have a pretty high tolerance for cold. There are others that will be diving big thick undergarments when I am in my mk2 and still others that are in a light undergarment when I am in the Antartica. So eash persons confort level is much different. The best thing to do is to borrow some if you can to see what kind of undergarment will work best for you. As bubbletrouble points out too, do not forget about your feet. For me personally the rest of me could be nice and toasty but if my feet get cold then I am not happy....

Phil

[bubbletrubble]

Originally Posted by skdvr

As bubbletrouble points out too, do not forget about your feet. For me personally the rest of me could be nice and toasty but if my feet get cold then I am not happy....

The Whites Fusion comes stock with booties that have little to no insulating properties. I guess that explains why skdvr uses the Antarctica "socks."
Definitely get something to keep your toes warm. Like skdvr, if my feet are cold...or worse yet, numb...I'm really not going to have fun on the dive.
Good luck...

[BORG]

I recently got some 4 way Antarctic Fleece from Ron. It looks like it will keep me super warm in the quarries and winter lake dives I'll be doing with my Pinnacle EVO2 drysuit. I need to get the booties next.

[CompuDude]

If possible, be sure to check out the undergarments from Fourth Element. They're not cheap, but they're among the warmest, driest, yet non-bulky undergarments I've come across.

[gregor]

I guess i'm one of the few people who are going to suggest thinsulate. I have a DUI 400gm thinsulate undergarment. The downsides, they are expensive (moreso since DUI has upped their prices in the last few years), need to be cared for very carefully (not washed often, put on and taken off carefully, folded not crammed into a bag, etc), they have no stretch to them, and they don't last forever. But i feel the upsides far outweigh the down.

These things are warm, period. The thinsulate is a type that does not compress under pressure, so the material doesn't require the "loft" of every other drysuit garment to maintain it's warmth. Things like weezle compress down to next to nothing (can fit the thing in a stuff sack the size of a grapefruit), so when underwater the less air you have in your suit, the less warm you are. With thinsulate this is not the case. I really feel no difference when diving the suit "snug" as opposed to a little looser in warmth factor. Another thing it's got going for it, the matrix of the fibers traps air well, so even during a suit flood the product continues to keep you warmer than wet polypro or something like that. I've had small partial leaks and even though i've "felt" wet, i never came up from those dives any colder than when i stayed perfectly dry. I've dove polypro and gotten wet, and that wet polypro caused me to get cold.

Like i said, there are downsides to thinsulate, but we are looking for warmth in a drysuit undergarmet, and thinsulate delivers on that.

[skdvr]

I am just not sure if for his water temp range that thinsulate would be a good answer... I guess the only thinsulate undergarments I have seen are 400g DUI and my buddie cannot even wear it with his DUI TLS 350 until the water temps get below 40*. Do they make thinsulate undergarments that are lighter than 400g?

Phil

[bubbletrubble]

Originally Posted by skdvr

I am just not sure if for his water temp range that thinsulate would be a good answer... I guess the only thinsulate undergarments I have seen are 400g DUI and my buddie cannot even wear it with his DUI TLS 350 until the water temps get below 40*. Do they make thinsulate undergarments that are lighter than 400g?

Phil

Phil, I own the Bare T100. Per the manufacturer marketing materials, the undergarment contains C100 Thinsulate. For the life of me, I don't know what "weight" (g/m2) the material is...probably 100g/m2. AFAIK, Bare also makes the warmer CT200 which contains B200 Thinsulate. The 3M website is very vague about the differences among their Thinsulate line. It makes it very difficult to compare Thinsulate to other materials in an apples-to-apples way. To make matters worse, Thinsulate has recently added Lite Loft and Ultra products to their lines. FWIW, I am comfortable in my T100 in water temps down to the low 50 degrees F. When it gets down to 50 or (gasp) 49, I picture myself in front of a warm fire...and keep my total dive times under 1 hour.

I just looked on the DUI website, and it appears that DUI also manufactures their undergarments in other thicknesses. They seem to offer a 200g product which may be suitable for the OP.

[skdvr]

I would like to try a thinsulate undergarment some time, but the only problem with that is that I am sure after I try one I will probably want to buy one. My hunting coveralls are made with Thinsulate (not sure what kind) and they are super warm when I spend all day out in 20* - 30* air temps.

Thanks for the info...

Phil

[gregor]

I've got the 400 weight of thinsulate, and to be honest, i've worn them in the caves that are 72 degrees in florida and aside from getting warm on the surface, once underwater i was comfortable in all but very hard working situations. Now that's not to say that 400 gram thinsulate is too much, but i feel fine in it during 50 degree dives. I guess everyone is different with regards to cold tolerance. I might just be a wuss when it comes to cold.

They do have various weights of thinsulate and different types, but the best type is the "type B" which has been compressed, it's the same type thats found in boots and stuff. The high loft types are not as good for diving situations. I'm not sure about other brands of manufacturers stuff, but the basic DUI thinsulate comes in 200 gram and 400 gram versions. Never dove the 200 gram stuff, but use older 400 gram jumpsuit for warmer dives, and newer 400 gram jumpsuit for colder stuff.

[gregor]

With the above stuff i posted, i also wanted to say, i'm probably going to pick up a set of the softwear 300 weight polartec for florida cave diving.