Is this normal!?!? - Navigation vs. Guided

[bmp51]

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<DIV>I have noticed with some diver groups, more and more divers are doing less “Dive work” Navigation, exploration etc. and just following the leader on guided dives….<?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /></DIV>

Do you think going on chartered dive trips all the time weakens you as a diver???

How many divers actually practice basic navigation, and run your safety drills every now and again?? Do a table or 2 just for a refresher? (other than in the next level of certification class..)

I am fairly new to diving, but have heard things like “ah don’t worry about it they will bring us up long before we hit a deco time” or “don’t worry about the dept, they won’t take us past 60 ft on this dive…” and my all time favorite “don’t worry about your air consumption, the dive will be over with long before you run out of air”

Is this normal??? Are divers and the diving community seriously taking the “put my life in their hands” attitude?

Just wondering what your experience has been and what you thought….

[cummings66]

Yes, playing follow the leader does not reinforce nor introduce new skills.
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[TxHockeyGuy]

I think a lot of the vacation destination places are doing nothing but guided dives. They have to play to the lowest common denominational which is the OW diver who just completed certification right before they left on vacation and is not yet aware of how to properly navigate. They also have to cater to those who do not dive on a regular basis and therefor have rusty skills.

My local diving is the exact opposite. You only see DM's with training classes and if you have no navigation skills it's not terribly difficult to get lost in a quarry. You have to plan your own dive.

[CompuDude]

They're called "trust me" dives, and IMO they are a terrible idea that brings out the worst in lazy vacation divers.

Fortunately, we don't really have them in So.Cal. unless you specifically hire a DM to lead you on one. Regular charters are transportation... the DMs on board will cheerfully help you topside, but they don't get into the water unless there is an emergency.

[Diver Dennis]

Unfortunately, the vast majority of divers do "trust me" dives and nothing else. Once certified, most divers only dive on vacation, maybe 5 to 10 dives a year. All my diving now is done at resorts in Asia and I solo dive almost all the time, taking pictures. These dives are all guided with a short dive briefing and then off you go. This includes places like Palau, Yap, Truk, Bali and the Philippines. The only place I couldn't solo was in Sipidan in Malaysia and they gave me my own DM.

That said, all the diving I do is warm water, good vis and usually no overhead. Cold water, low vis diving is totally different in my opinion, I don't dive in Canada anymore...

[jacewindu]

it doesn't teach you new skills... but i wouldn't say it makes you less able to navigate.

if you know how to use a compass, which is fairly simple anyways, playing follow the leader can be just a fun distraction, but won't take away your knowledge.

[CompuDude]

Originally Posted by jacewindu

it doesn't teach you new skills... but i wouldn't say it makes you less able to navigate.

if you know how to use a compass, which is fairly simple anyways, playing follow the leader can be just a fun distraction, but won't take away your knowledge.

If you're one of the rare people that will run their dive like that, yes. In the real world, however, it's not likely to work out that way, with occasional exceptions, of course.

[bmp51]

I just feel like its auto pilot diving.... I am just astonished at the level of "yah whatever" that goes on..... <?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" />


Just a personal thing I guess....

[PlatypusMan]

Originally Posted by TxHockeyGuy

I think a lot of the vacation destination places are doing nothing but guided dives. They have to play to the lowest common denominational which is the OW diver who just completed certification right before they left on vacation and is not yet aware of how to properly navigate. They also have to cater to those who do not dive on a regular basis and therefor have rusty skills.

There IS a way around this--look for groups who go on trips that are typically formed from a membership of divers who are experienced in a number of environments and a number of dives.

I belong to one such--and there are others out there, I'm sure. The dive ops tend to let us do our thing once they know what sort of divers we are; usually they check us out with a first "knock the cobwebs off" dive to be certain, and away we go.

[picxie]

I used to be one of those 'follow the leader' divers who only dived while on holidays. As someone has mentioned, these chartered dives need to cater for the least experience and if something happened, it would be on their heads. So in their eyes, it's the safest option. For me, it meant a relaxed dive which I enjoyed, rather than a potentially uncomfortable dive out of my depth (figuratively, not literally!).
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<DIV>Since finding a regular buddy and diving a bit with the same person, I have become much more comfortable in the water, and I have learnt heaps. We dive at various locations and although a leader is available if wanted, we dive on our own. And take turns to navigate. This has been a great learning curve for me as instead of following someone else, I've had to take responsibility for leading someone else. I have got us *sort of* lost on the odd occasion but nothing major . And when that happens I can't really complain too much at the longer surface swim at the end!!! </DIV>
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<DIV>Before, I used to expect the dive crew to help me with my gear. Now, I am surprised when they try to help me with my gear and it feels like royal treatment!!!</DIV>
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<DIV>IMO, if you want to learn, you need to take the step of diving without the guided tour all the time.</DIV>