In Case of Emergency

[ektess1]

Just added divers Alert Network to my phone. I had been meaning to for a while. Thanks.

[navyhmc]

Originally Posted by gNats

Navy - How do you think HIPAA reacts to the use of cell phone contact lists to contact someone in an emergency?

I work for an insurance company. Through the HIPAA policy guidelines, we have to respect the insureds' right to privacy - which includes not telling family members without permission.

(I know you know this Navy).

Could you see an instance where a person in the contact list was called (and not identified as ICE) and the patient became angry?

I guess, even if you have Mom or Dad in the list, that doesn't mean you want them to be called before your husband, who may just be listed as Robert.

Frankly, I always tell people call my mom last, after you have a complete understanding of the problem. I have to be FINE, dead, or need them to choose between life and death (because all other options have been applied).

Calling my mom and telling her I was in accident without details would be very very bad. She doesn't deal with huge trauma real well completely at first.

Ah, HIPAA, what a delightful little act of congress.

Well, like I said, I have not used the ICE to contact someone as of yet. I have in very rare cases made contact with a parent or patient requested family member so in those cases, HIPAA restrictions are satisfied.

IANAL, but I would imagine that IF the situation did present itself that I did need to get some patient information ASAP that would likely be available from the person identified as the In Case of Emergency by the patient, the fact that they have identified the person as a contact could be considered implied permission.

I am not going to be giving a lot of information myself. My first act will be to identify myself, inform the person that they were identified as the person to contact in an emergency and we have one now. It's not a HIPAA violation for me to ask them for pertinent information with giving no specifics about the current crisis.

With all that said, I still haven't used an ICE number. If any one gets to make those calls, it will be someone at the hospital...I will be too busy to make that call.

You give the other reasons why for us paramedics not to use it. Can a number identified as the ICE be a good thing? Probably, but it's limited in scope.

[Skred]

Originally Posted by navyhmc

Ah, HIPAA, what a delightful little act of congress.

Well, like I said, I have not used the ICE to contact someone as of yet. I have in very rare cases made contact with a parent or patient requested family member so in those cases, HIPAA restrictions are satisfied.

IANAL, but I would imagine that IF the situation did present itself that I did need to get some patient information ASAP that would likely be available from the person identified as the In Case of Emergency by the patient, the fact that they have identified the person as a contact could be considered implied permission.

I am not going to be giving a lot of information myself. My first act will be to identify myself, inform the person that they were identified as the person to contact in an emergency and we have one now. It's not a HIPAA violation for me to ask them for pertinent information with giving no specifics about the current crisis.

With all that said, I still haven't used an ICE number. If any one gets to make those calls, it will be someone at the hospital...I will be too busy to make that call.

You give the other reasons why for us paramedics not to use it. Can a number identified as the ICE be a good thing? Probably, but it's limited in scope.

Would this not be possibly more applicable to police than EMTs?

[Empacher]

Working in an Emergency Department, We've called an ICE number on more than one occasion! It s a great idea!!

[navyhmc]

Originally Posted by Skred

Would this not be possibly more applicable to police than EMTs?

That is where I can imagine that it would be of the most benefit. LEO's aren't held to the same HIPAA as we are. That and they have more time to investigate things.

In a critical call, I can't remember any times that I have brought a critical patient to the ER and they have not treated them because I didn't give them a name, date of birth or the like. This is especially true of bad car accident victims and serious trauma victims. The answer "I don't know has always sufficied so far. A lot of times, it's the PD officers taht give the hospital and me patient information.

[CFDAlden]

If you do put the ICE info in your phones, make sure you keep it updated! Things change, and if you don't change your info, it could be bad.

Story: A friend who is a full time Medic used this ONCE. And only once. His call was to an ex, who proceeded to tell my buddy of in very explicit terms what to do to his patient, and where he could place his "instrumentation".

[medic001918]

In my years as a paramedic, I've never (and won't ever) use a person's cell phone for any information. If the hospital wants to use it, that's on them. My issue in the uncontrolled prehospital environment is can I be guaranteed that the phone that's in my hand really belongs to the patient? It'd suck to call someone's ICE contact and ask questions only to find out it was the wrong patient and it was a friends phone. There would be all kinds of consequences to that. Also, if someone is sick or injured to the point they can't tell me anything, I have other things that I have to be doing rather than looking through someone's phone. It might work for the hospital, but where I have limited resources people should be happy if their phone makes it to the hospital with them. If it's not on them when I find them and they're that bad...I don't look for a phone to bring with me. It gets left on scene, in the car, etc. I look for a drivers license as a means to identify a patient rather than a phone.

A better idea would be to keep an information card (similar to a file of life) that has your information on it in your wallet next to your ID. It'll have your name, address, phone number, emergency contacts, medications, medical history, allergies, etc on it. This would allow the name to be matched with the ID to confirm that the right person is being notified and provide the needed medical information.
The way cell phones get lost, borrowed or stolen...I don't view it as a reliable source of information in an emergency.

Shane

[waytooslow]

wow my eyes, I did not even read from all the huge type - can someone fix - Foo????

[Foo2]

Originally Posted by waytooslow

wow my eyes, I did not even read from all the huge type - can someone fix - Foo????

Done.

[Queen]

Originally Posted by Empacher

Working in an Emergency Department, We've called an ICE number on more than one occasion! It s a great idea!!

That's what I've heard from friends working in the local ED. For the paramedics I wear a Road ID when I'm out on the motorcycle or bicycle.