Wreck Penetration?

[WaScubaDude]

Originally Posted by easyrider003

I was sitting around the Fire Station late last night and was just watching videos on youtube of people diving on different wrecks. I noticed in a majority of the videos that all the divers were going in and out of the wrecks. One of the videos was of an airplane wreck. They would just go in one door and out the other or may just turn and go into the cockpit for a very brief period of time. I was always taught that not to go into any overhead environments if your not trained. Now not saying that they werent trained or whatever but could an OW diver still go into something like a small cessna for a very brief period of time and still be ok? I have been on dives before off the coast of panama city and have noticed OW divers doing this very same thing. Just wanting your thought on this. Thanks

It's an interesting question really. I have done lots of REEF swim throughs with a DM in the lead. My new DB (my wife) won't do them and i honor that and stay with her when diving together. Made for an interesting night dive as we would go over the reef and have to find the group that went thru the reef, but it all worked out.

[cummings66]

I forgot to say this about the small Cessna. I own and fly one, there is no way on Earth you could pay me enough money to enter one under water. They're a PITA to get in on land, water would be insane.

[MLenyo]

Originally Posted by cummings66

...Do you know what he said to me on the surface?

"That's what buddies are for". He just doesn't get it, and didn't either after we had our talk...

that's outrageous! people just don't realize the dumb things they do sometimes, i guess.

read the "lost in a cave" story, SCARY!

[cbope]

I'll admit that on my deep checkout dive (27m) for my AOW cert, my DM and I penetrated a wreck. The wreck was very "open" and at no time did I feel like it was a confined space. The wreck is over 50 years old and a large section of the side has fallen away, plus it was a pretty large vessel to start with. I was a bit hesitant at first, but when I saw how open it was, I didn't have a problem. The hole where we entered was at least 5-6m in length and 3-4 m in height. At no time did I feel I couldn't ascend quickly if needed.

I certainly don't advocate penetrating wrecks without additional training, although I did it while fully understanding the risks. I evaluated the situation before entering the wreck and did not see any significant risks, although I realize that unseen risks could be present. I definitely will not penetrate more confined wrecks without proper training.

[Buoyant1]

Originally Posted by Kingpatzer

If you pick up the book "Diver Down" you'll find a number of true stories of people who got into situations they weren't prepared for, or where they reacted badly. One of these is the story of a girl who followed her boyfriend into a wreck for a look around.

She died, another dive master was crippled for life, the idiot who decided to start the whole thing lived, if I recall. The simple reality is that you're rarely just risking your own life. People will try and help you.

Like I said up thread -- the problem is not knowing what you don't know. I don't think swim throughs are a big problem, and large open wrecks looking in and swimming right out is probably ok.

But smaller wrecks where you can get snagged, or going into an area where a silt-out is possible, and then the stakes are raised significantly.

If you want to do wreck diving, take a course. If you want to do penetration diving, take a course. Learn what you need to know to stay alive.

I took a simple PADI wreck specialty, and the gist of the penetration techniques stem around evaluating the wreck before going in and STILL using a reel!

A lot of people get weird about swim throughs, but I've been doing them since my cert dives, (tubes, busses, helicptors etc.) the Wreck course gave me more knowledge and a better outlook on where NOT to attempt it...
Now by the same token...Gary Gentiles books...mainly the two about the Andrea Doria, and the two about the Lusitania... tell you to learn crazy stuff before doing it!...nope sorry, I'm not going in THAT far at THAT depth without a reel!

[texdiveguy]

Originally Posted by Buoyant1

I took a simple PADI wreck specialty, and the gist of the penetration techniques stem around evaluating the wreck before going in and STILL using a reel!

A lot of people get weird about swim throughs, but I've been doing them since my cert dives, (tubes, busses, helicptors etc.) the Wreck course gave me more knowledge and a better outlook on where NOT to attempt it...
Now by the same token...Gary Gentiles books...mainly the two about the Andrea Doria, and the two about the Lusitania... tell you to learn crazy stuff before doing it!...nope sorry, I'm not going in THAT far at THAT depth without a reel!

Yea it is crazy what some folks will try to pull off....if they just would stop and use common sense.....but the lure is to strong for a few and they get in trouble. Wreck penetration diving is serious business and as we all should know can turn south real fast. Without the proper experience level and appropriate gear and the skill to us it, know one should attempt a true wreck penetration. Large swim throws are one thing, but a true wreck is a whole different beast.

[doczerothree]

A divers best piece of equipment is between thier ears.

SEMPER DEEP

[emcbride81]

I have read, in Shadow Divers as well as other websites, that hard core wreck divers look at reels as a crutch that can get you killed. With sharp metals that can cut the line, if you do not have the mental "map" you are screwed. It seems that at least some will not use them period. In fact I think in Shadow Divers, the father/son that died were using a reel...even though that was not what killed them.

This is just what I have read, I just did my first penetration on the Mama Vina in PDC and that was just a straight swim through, nothing intense.

[DivingCRNA]

Originally Posted by emcbride81

I just did my first penetration on the Mama Vina in PDC and that was just a straight swim through, nothing intense.

This sentence says it all....


As for the Rouse's... There were about 5 things that could have prevented their deaths. It cannot be pinned down to one thing about the dive. The reel really did not matter.

[texdiveguy]

Originally Posted by emcbride81

I have read, in Shadow Divers as well as other websites, that hard core wreck divers look at reels as a crutch that can get you killed. With sharp metals that can cut the line, if you do not have the mental "map" you are screwed. It seems that at least some will not use them period. In fact I think in Shadow Divers, the father/son that died were using a reel...even though that was not what killed them.

This is just what I have read, I just did my first penetration on the Mama Vina in PDC and that was just a straight swim through, nothing intense.

Progressive penetration was the way it was done in years past in wreck diving. Today the 'line' is the preferred method in conjunction with the skill and awareness of progressive penetration. Special safeguards are part of the protocols followed in laying a line within a wreck....they differ in some part from cave diving line laying because of that risk of line damage/cut. I don't agree a reel/line is a crutch on wreck or any other structural penetration dive.